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Hosted => Battlestar Galactica: Beyond the Red Line => Topic started by: Werthead on June 07, 2008, 08:41:33 PM

Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 07, 2008, 08:41:33 PM
I'll just point out that I really hate the numbering system for this season, but I adhered to it to prevent confusion with the previous episode thread.

Anyway trailers for the next episode:

The Canadian one. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJBcJD7HakE&eurl=http://galacticasitrep.blogspot.com/)

The US one. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJKodTKxMz8&eurl=http://galacticasitrep.blogspot.com/)

What we know:

This is the final episode until 2009 (arrgh!). Current rumours suggest that the show will be back in early January 2009 though, rather than having to wait all the way until next April.
It's written by Bradley Thompson and David Weddle, who have written some of the show's biggest episodes.
It's directed by Michael Rymer, who's directed most of of the major episodes of the series as well.
David Eick has apparently said that the mid-season cliffhanger, by itself, is as big as New Caprica.
Katee Sackhoff has said they could have finished with either 410 or 411 (or 412/413 using the official production numbers) as the final episode of the whole series. Difficult to see how that tracks with the 'cliffhanger' note above though.
According to other souces, Lee is going to wish he never became president and Cylon forces will hold Roslin prisoner in an attempt to flush the Final Five out of hiding.
There will be more 'webisodes' bridging Seasons 4.0-4.5, suggesting a possible gap of time between the two halves of the season.

From the trailers (do we spoil these or not? Doing it for safety):

[spoiler]Roslin urges Adama to destroy the crippled Cylon basestar.
Tyrol notices that something has 'changed' about Starbuck's Viper. Whether he means since it came back from the Nebula or since the original Viper was destroyed is unclear.
The Penultimate Four are on the hanger deck with two Cylon Centurions in the background.
Tigh tells Adama that he is a Cylon.
Lee punches Tigh. I could be wrong, but I think there's a shot of Adama punching Tigh as well.
Adama also punches a mirror with real anger and heartache.
Tory manages to get onto the Cylon basestar. She tells Roslin she's through taking her orders and is going back to her people. We see Tory on the basestar talking to the other Cylons, who look stunned (guess that Adama doesn't nuke the basestar after all).
Tigh is alone in the launch tube with the doors closing.
However, we then see Tigh, Anders and Tyrol in the launch tube, possibly with their hands tied together.
Starbuck is in her new Viper checking something out. We see an unusual control mechanism (not the DRADIS, looks more like a targeting computer).
Starbuck then races into the launch tube control room just as Lee and Dualla are about to space the Cylons and tells that the three Cylons have just given them Earth.
There is a shot of what looks like Raptors and shuttles decending towards a blue-white planet (Earth?).
Roslin and D'Anna in the rain in what may be a harsh landscape, not looking particularly happy.
Adama having some kind of breakdown in Lee's arms on Colonial One, talking about all the people he's sent to die.[/spoiler]

Something tells me this isn't going to be this season's 'comedy episode' :eek2:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 07, 2008, 09:39:42 PM
How can they call these few episodes a season?
When they said the final season episode I wasn't just irritated I was disenfranchised by the whole use of the show by Sci Fi channel
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: combat on June 07, 2008, 09:44:00 PM
Jannuary 2009?!! Damit
Well i just hope stargate atlantis starts showing new episodes soon
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Blue Lion on June 07, 2008, 09:45:55 PM
Those are coming out in July I believe
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: FOX2PRO on June 07, 2008, 11:20:13 PM
Umm, SciFi says it's airing it next Friday...I'm pretty sure this season is non-stop, or something close to it.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 08, 2008, 01:03:33 AM
Episode 410 (aka 412), Revelations, airs next Friday in the USA and is the mid-season finale. The next episode, Sometimes a Great Notion, will not air until January 2009 at the earliest according to the tagline on the ads.

Even though we've known about this for ages, it still sucks.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 08, 2008, 01:04:35 AM
Quote from: KewlToyZ;102243
How can they call these few episodes a season?
When they said the final season episode I wasn't just irritated I was disenfranchised by the whole use of the show by Sci Fi channel



Officially they aren't, this is just the "first half" of the season.  I would be OK with that if it was a few weeks between first half second half but this IS getting ridiculous.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 08, 2008, 02:25:22 PM
you have to renember, the writers stike happened while the second half of the season was still being written, and you cant just film an episode and show it, you have to go through all the post production and those kinds of things, and sci-fi then needs an empty slot to show it in.

As much as i hate to admit it, you cant blame sci-fi for this one, its acturally the writers strike you need to blame. But the writers strike happened due to the TV companies, such as sci-fi...

Just blame the american tv channels in general come to think of it
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Ender on June 08, 2008, 03:12:45 PM
star gate atlantis starts july 12 but i swear to god i seen sometinhg said it was june 12 or somewhere near that
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 08, 2008, 06:40:45 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;102291
you have to renember, the writers stike happened while the second half of the season was still being written, and you cant just film an episode and show it, you have to go through all the post production and those kinds of things, and sci-fi then needs an empty slot to show it in.

As much as i hate to admit it, you cant blame sci-fi for this one, its acturally the writers strike you need to blame. But the writers strike happened due to the TV companies, such as sci-fi...

Just blame the american tv channels in general come to think of it


The writers strike was nowhere near as long as the season break is scheduled to go, and Sci-Fi had announced BEFORE the strike that they were going to split the season with dates TBD.  So I would accept a six to eight week break with little complaint, but making the break a minimum of six months is ridiculous.  

Primary photography is already finished for the entire series which would leave 11+~8 weeks on that kind of schedule to finish post production and vfx before the final episode would need to be in the can to air.  Well within constraints to produce quality work.  Now we get 26+ weeks of dead-time plus the 11+ ~8 before the final episode airs.  WAAAYYYY more than is necessary to do quality post-production work, it's just pure capricious schedule delay.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: combat on June 08, 2008, 07:39:01 PM
but where did you find out about the 6 month midseson break
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TripRussell on June 08, 2008, 09:09:00 PM
after this eppie.. the BIG wait begins
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 08, 2008, 10:04:16 PM
Quote from: TripRussell;102332
after this eppie.. the BIG wait begins


Gives us all time for some really bizarre speculation.
Oh wait, we don't need time for that!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 08, 2008, 10:11:45 PM
Quote from: combat;102325
but where did you find out about the 6 month midseson break


Sci-fi commercials say in BSG returns in 2009!  That's actually a little over six months, but close enough for bitching purposes.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 09, 2008, 02:28:20 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;102291
you have to renember, the writers stike happened while the second half of the season was still being written, and you cant just film an episode and show it, you have to go through all the post production and those kinds of things, and sci-fi then needs an empty slot to show it in.

As much as i hate to admit it, you cant blame sci-fi for this one, its acturally the writers strike you need to blame. But the writers strike happened due to the TV companies, such as sci-fi...

Just blame the american tv channels in general come to think of it

Except that they've just started shooting the series finale this week and completed post on up to ep 16 or 17, I believe. They could show the whole series right through with no problem whatsoever. As others have said, they're splitting the season solely to make more money. The main motivation seems to be that they can split the Season 4 DVD sets and charge $50 for each half-season rather than $60 for the whole season box set (this is the same crap they pulled with Season 2). Plus they probably want to use Season 4.5 to generate audiences for Caprica which should air around the same time.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Star Dragon on June 09, 2008, 03:39:00 PM
Excuse me but isn't RDM the main writer for the show? Did he actually stop???
I wouldn't if it was my heart and soul, plus further more I'd have the jump on every other idiots who DID stop! (not that they don't deserve a raise, they had a point about DVD's)

What's going to happen, the writing police kick down my door cause a psychic told them I was typing on my PC at night working on BSG with my shades closed???

PLEASE...

I'd rather be spoiled now than wait another year now that I've gotten more and more angry as this "season" has progressed...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 09, 2008, 05:40:23 PM
Quote from: Star Dragon;102391
Excuse me but isn't RDM the main writer for the show? Did he actually stop???
I wouldn't if it was my heart and soul, plus further more I'd have the jump on every other idiots who DID stop! (not that they don't deserve a raise, they had a point about DVD's)

What's going to happen, the writing police kick down my door cause a psychic told them I was typing on my PC at night working on BSG with my shades closed???

PLEASE...

I'd rather be spoiled now than wait another year now that I've gotten more and more angry as this "season" has progressed...



some of them might of been doing some work during the strike, but during the day, most of the writers where on the picket lines of the strike.

Also, you cant write episodes you havent really planned. And from what i can tell, most of there material was in there office. i read in one of the writers blogs about them going back to the offices and all there material still being how it was when they left to go on strike. im just not sure whos blog it was
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 09, 2008, 11:37:14 PM
This is a game by the network, not the writers or production.
Honestly, I'm salty enough about this bs delay not to buy the sets anymore.
I just don't like being jerked around by marketing trash.
If I catch anymore shows after this fine, but I'm not wasting anymore time on this commercial felgercarb.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 10, 2008, 12:04:50 AM
Quote from: Werthead;102380
Except that they've just started shooting the series finale this week and completed post on up to ep 16 or 17, I believe. They could show the whole series right through with no problem whatsoever. As others have said, they're splitting the season solely to make more money. The main motivation seems to be that they can split the Season 4 DVD sets and charge $50 for each half-season rather than $60 for the whole season box set (this is the same crap they pulled with Season 2). Plus they probably want to use Season 4.5 to generate audiences for Caprica which should air around the same time.



I heard primary shooting was a wrap, but between your and my estimations it's still only a one week delta.  And if post is already done through 16/17 you are only confirming there would be plenty of time to finish the rest with a 6-8 week break.  We agree it is Universal Suits in charge of this piss-ant call.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 11, 2008, 01:32:27 PM
probably still have alot of work left to do on the special effects, music, all the other stuff to go with it.....
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 11, 2008, 04:15:00 PM
Here's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGFNu_HZ-tw) a two-minute preview of the ep. Interesting stuff.

There's some confusion at the moment as apparently the Sci-Fi Channel are considering expanding the two-part finale to three hours. They'll have to make that call soon as they're shooting the second half of the finale next week, so if they want to go to a third ep they'll have to whack it onto the following and week and have the writers flesh out the script between now and then.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 11, 2008, 08:27:41 PM
In response i can only say

I wanna see it now!!!!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 12, 2008, 12:15:25 AM
Interesting.

There's a special screening in LA of the mid-season finale tonight, with RDM, Mary McDonnell and Eddie Olmos present, among many others. Apparently they're really keen to guage the fans' reactions to certain scenes.

This also means that spoilers for the whole episode will be appearing in a few hours, two days prior to the broadcast.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 12, 2008, 02:57:41 AM
According to Scifi.com you can watch the entire episode streamed online each hour starting at 9 am Friday June 13th.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 12, 2008, 09:47:06 AM
Quote from: wiley;102930
According to Scifi.com you can watch the entire episode streamed online each hour starting at 9 am Friday June 13th.


so they dont want the UK to be ahead of them, probally because it will lower ratings

but they dont mind there fans watching it online instead of on TV? unless they count online views into there ratings for how much programs where watched?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 12, 2008, 11:13:37 AM
You can't stream Sci-Fi Channel website or Hulu stuff outside of the USA. Well, you can, but you need to set up a US proxy server which is a bit of a pain.

The biggest revelation from the episode, (apart from the obvious, which I think everyone knows about by now):

[spoiler]D'Anna only wants the Four because the Fifth 'Isn't in the Fleet'. WTH?[/spoiler]

Looks like we need to start guessing again.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 12, 2008, 12:35:44 PM
is that earth is see in the trailer, where all the ships are flying too??
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 12, 2008, 12:37:25 PM
[spoiler]Yes. The coordinates were hidden in Starbuck's Viper's targetting computer all along.[/spoiler]
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 12, 2008, 12:41:59 PM
cheers :)

....dont think there is any need for the spoiler tags, the title of
    the thread says 'MAJOR SPOILERS'
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 12, 2008, 02:17:10 PM
Actually, I'm grateful that the posters who do know what's actually going to happen during the mid-season cliffhanger are using the invisotext.  The title of this thread includes the word "speculation" in it, and while spoilers are warned about, I think that most people would interpret the pairing of those two words in a fashion similar to how I understand it, which is, "Hey kids, come here and talk about what you think is going to happen, and don't be surprised if some of your guesses end up being correct, meaning that they'll be spoilers..."

If that's how I was thinking when I first entered this thread, and then read text that clearly was accurate due to coming from a production source, well, I'd be upset by that, and that's exactly what's going on now.  Please keep the invisotext for actual non-speculative spoilers.  I suggest that we start a whole new thread regarding Episode 12 once it starts airing.

Ain't It Cool News has posted up a spoiler free review of the cliffhanger, and it sounds like a hell of a ride (click here for article: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/37054 ).  

I am so happy that they're streaming it tomorrow on the hour every hour in the U.S.A.  I better get my kayak and paddles out...

:)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Malcolm_Sevargam on June 12, 2008, 05:22:12 PM
Quote from: Werthead;102890

There's some confusion at the moment as apparently the Sci-Fi Channel are considering expanding the two-part finale to three hours. They'll have to make that call soon as they're shooting the second half of the finale next week, so if they want to go to a third ep they'll have to whack it onto the following and week and have the writers flesh out the script between now and then.


Wait are you talking about the mid season finale or the series one?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 12, 2008, 06:04:53 PM
The series one ;) If they were shooting the mid-season finale until next week, they could hardly screen it in the USA tomorrow. And the mid-season finale is only a one-hour episode.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 12, 2008, 07:25:14 PM
from what i read earlier, the series finale is currently being filmed. but i guess if the writers could come up with another hours content and can fit it in, then its possible i guess. Adding another hours worth of scenes could be tricky, i know the writers for BSG are good, but is anyone THAT good?
Title: Season 4 Episode 10 Spoilers and further discussion of series
Post by: TESLA on June 12, 2008, 07:50:19 PM
Greetings to all :)



Since there are issues over spoilers vs speculation. :nervous:
This thread can include all discussion with spoilers and speculation without the use of spoiler tags.

To those lucky people who will view the episode first tomorrow, i cant wait to hear your reports on the episode, and what happens!!!!

Will all be revealed???????????????????
Do they find Earth? Is it wrecked?
Who dies?
What ship gets blown up?
Does anyone want to go for a pint?
How can RDM leave us waiting for a whole year!!
Will Cl1nt go insane trying to wait a whole year?
Will Enki end up murdering Spork?
Is Omniscaper still alive?
Is Karajorma really a human or a Cylon?
is it true that Wolfy is not really a wolf but merely a sheep in wolf's clothing?
Will Wiley and Star Dragon start to blow things up?


Some very important questions that will be asked and raised all the way until 2009!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes people a whole fraking six months away!!!!!

So feel free to take a breath of fresh air, walk outside, scream and curse at the wall, and come back in when feeling better :)
This shall be the thread that will be discussed the what-ifs until 2009.







Werthead has already pointed out some important bits of information.....









Roslin urges Adama to destroy the crippled Cylon basestar.

Tyrol notices that something has 'changed' about Starbuck's Viper.

Whether he means since it came back from the Nebula or since the original Viper was destroyed is unclear.

The Penultimate Four are on the hanger deck with two Cylon Centurions in the background.

Tigh tells Adama that he is a Cylon.

Lee punches Tigh. I could be wrong, but I think there's a shot of Adama punching Tigh as well.

Adama also punches a mirror with real anger and heartache.
Tory manages to get onto the Cylon basestar.

She tells Roslin she's through taking her orders and is going back to her people.

We see Tory on the basestar talking to the other Cylons, who look stunned (guess that Adama doesn't nuke the basestar after all).

Tigh is alone in the launch tube with the doors closing.

However, we then see Tigh, Anders and Tyrol in the launch tube, possibly with their hands tied together.

Starbuck is in her new Viper checking something out. We see an unusual control mechanism (not the DRADIS, looks more like a targeting computer).
Starbuck then races into the launch tube control room just as Lee and Dualla are about to space the Cylons and tells that the three Cylons have just given them Earth.

There is a shot of what looks like Raptors and shuttles decending towards a blue-white planet (Earth?).

Roslin and D'Anna in the rain in what may be a harsh landscape, not looking particularly happy.

Adama having some kind of breakdown in Lee's arms on Colonial One, talking about all the people he's sent to die.









So now is the time, the hour, the show, what the frak is going on, what will be revealed, how dark can this show get, who lives, who dies, why is a toothbrush not called a teethbrush, and most importantly will the fans be happy with this mid season ending? And will it raise more questions that it answers....... ;) Only the God(s) know the answer. :doubtful:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 12, 2008, 08:04:29 PM
There is always plenty of stuff that hits the cutting room floor due to time, so the process is probably less traumatic than it first seems.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 12, 2008, 08:11:29 PM
In D. Eicks Videoblog is a vid called "Are you frakkin' kidding me?", and it gives a hint who probably bites the dust.
Hint from me: near the end of the vid...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 12, 2008, 11:14:51 PM
I found a couple reviews of the Reveletions Premiere event.
One of them is Spoiler-filled.
...
...
...
ARGH, i simply couldn't resist, and i want to watch this episode NOW!!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 12, 2008, 11:59:52 PM
im doing quite well at avoiding anything TOO spoilery.

but im totally avoiding this forum now untill tuesday. im determined i wont watch it online, or find out what happens more than i already know. And i know if i come on here, il just be too tempted
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 13, 2008, 02:00:58 PM
Il admit, i just watched int on the Sc-fi website... i was planning to wait untill tuesday, but i didnt. I dunno wether im aloud to talk about what happened now or untill after its shown on tv in america.

so for now, i have some of teslas questions to answer!!!

Quote from: TESLA;102978
Will all be revealed???????????????????
Do they find Earth? Is it wrecked?
Who dies?
What ship gets blown up?
Does anyone want to go for a pint?
How can RDM leave us waiting for a whole year!!
Will Cl1nt go insane trying to wait a whole year?
Will Enki end up murdering Spork?
Is Omniscaper still alive?
Is Karajorma really a human or a Cylon?
is it true that Wolfy is not really a wolf but merely a sheep in wolf's clothing?
Will Wiley and Star Dragon start to blow things up?


1. Yes, to a certain extent
2. some dude being thrown out the baseship airlock (seriously, how many more people are there left to airlock?)
3. No
4. Sure, which pub? my local or yours?
5. Dont blame RDM, blame sci-fi
6. Hes already insane
7. Almost defineatly
8. I hope so, though im not THAT sure
9. No, but didnt we already know that?
10. That is not true
11. Almost defineatly

anyway, moveing on. I  love the really happy ending, with everyone cheering, Lee Adama stripping on that table in the CIC, Starbuck talking to Photo Kat, then everyones down on the planet looking nice and
[spoiler]MISERABLE[/spoiler]

so anyway, who acturally IS the president of the colonies? Adama or Roslin?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 13, 2008, 03:35:15 PM
They are all going to start blowing things up, soon as they see the price of Tylium.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 13, 2008, 07:28:25 PM
It seems to me from the conversation that Lee had with Roslin that she has resumed her presidential status.  She lets Lee know that he should expect to be president again due to his superb performance and even though it goes unsaid, her impending death due to her cancer.

It's remarkable really, how little was actually answered in terms of all the questions we've had.  In fact, all they did, for the most part, is reaffirm questions that we were asking and hoping that they'll answer without having to jump a shark to do it.  This actually boosts my confidence some, it's as if the writers of the show are trying to calm us worriers down by letting us know that they know what our concerns are.  Tigh's revelation to Adama is a perfect example of what I mean: during that conversation, Adama expressly states that Tigh has aged, and that's impossible for a Cylon.  Tigh's response is, well, I guess you're wrong Bill.  I basically have no idea as to what I am exactly or how I came to be.  By the way, why don't you vacuum-surf me into space before we find out the answers...  :lol:

The new questions for me are:
(1) Who is sending the signal to the four?
(2) It's clear that the three skinjobs on the hanger didn't do anything to directly alter Starbuck's viper.  So who did alter it, or was it simply activated by the Cylon radio signal as well?  
(3) Deanna said that there were only four out of the five missing Cylon skinjobs amongst the human fleet.  At the time, Roslin and Baltar were on board the Cylon baseship.  Deanna seemed genuinely pleased to see Baltar, but later on didn't really warm up to his trying to convince her to stand down the escalation of violence.  If Baltar was the final skinjob, I would think that Deanna would follow his lead, but...  So, were there any other semi-significant members of the human fleet on board the Cylon basestar when Deanna made her "...there's only four..." statement?  If so, whom?  And out of all of those, which is the most likely contender to be the fifth skinjob?
(4) Isn't Roslin supposed to die and never make it to Earth?  Yet she's clearly next to Adama on its surface at the end.  What the?  If they are on Earth, what in the world does the "breaking" of this prophecy mean?
(5) Somebody left Earth in the frying pan for too long!  How'd it get so crispy, and is it seasoned with The Colonel's secret herbs and spices?

I loved the windy and charred ending of this episode.  And for what it does cover in terms of plot and character development, it does it well, although not a whole lot is answered, and more questions are raised.

I guess I'll come back to its final 12 episodes next fall (yes, "12" and no longer "10").  :yes:  

Lots to look forward to.  And at least one more BSG movie on its way to boot!

:)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 13, 2008, 07:49:25 PM
hm, for earth, id seculate we kind of didnt cut our CO2 emissions, or George Bush started a nuclear war, or even both?

Also, as for who else was on the cylon baseship: Half the viper pilots (and some raptor crews), and presumably some of the marines. Notable people include: Seelix (not likely to be the final cylon) and Hotdog.

out of the notable people there, it most likely to be Hotdog i think, hes been there fromt he start as well, though that doent seem to matter.

as for people no longer in the fleet: Kat, Billy, Eloshia, probally somemore ive forgotten about.

And is it me, or is tis the first episode weve acturally seen a baseship missile launcher up close, when they loaded the nukes?

so anyway, any theories ont he rest of the season? colonials and ylons going to Kobol, tryng to make a truce with the other cylons, and trying to get the Final Cylon?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 13, 2008, 07:54:44 PM
Hm, the only other 'noticeable' characters on board the Basestar are Helo, Hotdog and Seelix.
Ok, there are 40+ other Pilots and Marines, but none of them has been seen before ( they are the BSG version of the TOS Star Trek - redshirts - Security crew, if someone of them get a line to speak, you'll see him/ her die later in that episode, see the Hub), so there it's unlikely one of them.

Ah, the clock is running...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Michilus on June 13, 2008, 08:00:46 PM
Well that rocked. I guess they'll have no choice but to blow cavil out of the sky now.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 13, 2008, 08:34:27 PM
I don't want to push one of my observations too hard, but still...

What if they're not on Earth at the end of the episode, but rather a terraformed Mars (named after the God of War, remember, and so could signify a lot of things), or far less likely in my opinion, Venus?

Perhaps they're in the Sol System, but not yet at Earth.  Really, how would they know what Earth should like?  If they appeared above a devastated Mars, how could they know the difference?

That would mean that Roslin still hasn't made it to Earth yet, and most likely, never will.  The Prophecy will stay sacrosanct and intact.  

Just wondering what you all think of this as a probability and possibility...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 13, 2008, 08:44:06 PM
Quote from: Kyle_K_ski;103052
I don't want to push one of my observations too hard, but still...

What if they're not on Earth at the end of the episode, but rather a terraformed Mars (named after the God of War, remember, and so could signify a lot of things), or far less likely in my opinion, Venus?

Perhaps they're in the Sol System, but not yet at Earth.  Really, how would they know what Earth should like?  If they appeared above a devastated Mars, how could they know the difference?

That would mean that Roslin still hasn't made it to Earth yet, and most likely, never will.  The Prophecy will stay sacrosanct and intact.  

Just wondering what you all think of this as a probability and possibility...




Well, Mars and Venus are very close to earth, you don't need a telescope to see them.
The Colonials seem to have telescopes that can spot planets in OTHER systems ( s1x02 Water - Tigh mentions it to Adama ).
it really seems to be earth. We have to wait a couple of hours, then we will know what the continents look like.

I know the answer already, but i'll probably get killed and then banned if i post it here. :biggrin1:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Elthis on June 13, 2008, 09:13:34 PM
I added spoiler tags because the possibility of it being true is probable since I've seen it floating around for a while.

Edit: Speculation on the origin of the beacon that led them to earth.

[spoiler]What if the emergency transponder beacon that kara's new viper picked up was the beacon from her old viper.

There have been rumors that Kara finds her old viper crashed with her body still inside.[/spoiler]
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lancer on June 13, 2008, 11:46:56 PM
'(4) Isn't Roslin supposed to die and never make it to Earth? Yet she's clearly next to Adama on its surface at the end. What the? If they are on Earth, what in the world does the "breaking" of this prophecy mean?'

well it doesn't actually break the prophecy.

don't forget, the way they've spoken of Pythia's writings, tehy would be led to earth by a dying leader.

Well we know Roslin is dying, it doesn't necessarily track she has to die before they reach earth. prophecy fulfilled.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 13, 2008, 11:55:57 PM
Quote from: Lancer;103068
'(4) Isn't Roslin supposed to die and never make it to Earth? Yet she's clearly next to Adama on its surface at the end. What the? If they are on Earth, what in the world does the "breaking" of this prophecy mean?'

well it doesn't actually break the prophecy.

don't forget, the way they've spoken of Pythia's writings, tehy would be led to earth by a dying leader.

Well we know Roslin is dying, it doesn't necessarily track she has to die before they reach earth. prophecy fulfilled.



The prophecy says: ...the leader suffered a wasting disease and would not live to enter the new land

I think they are referring to the phrase: this all has happened before, this all will happen again, that's what ... meant as he talked with ... .


Sry, no spoilers.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 12:08:48 AM
Well 2 hrs to go and I dont see the broadcast on Sci Fi?
Who saw it?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: David cgc on June 14, 2008, 12:29:26 AM
I watched it twice. It streamed beginning every hour on the hour from 9 am to 4 pm EDT.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 14, 2008, 12:31:39 AM
Alright Angelus,

You're driving me crazy man!  If you've got "The Goods" on what's happening, and I don't, then that makes me want to know them when I don't want to know them!  That's an enigma caught in the black hole of a paradox, and my frustration level of wanting something I don't want is making me more frustrated...

And I read your spoiler regarding SPOILER Kara finding her crashed viper with her corpse in it SPOILER, and I didn't want to read that, but I did!  Arrrrrrrrrrgh-gh-GAH!

Then I read your response to my query
Quote
The prophecy says: ...the leader suffered a wasting disease and would not live to enter the new land

I think they are referring to the phrase: this all has happened before, this all will happen again, that's what ... meant as he talked with ... .
and I started thinking about your last broken statement, and it has my mind racing in all kinds of different directions, and I have to ask is a SPOILER form of time travel involved?  My understanding of the "what's happened before will happen again" line is that the whole cycle of humans build Cylons as slaves, the Cylons revolt, bring each other to the brink of extinction, find out that they're really one and the same, have babies together-actually becoming "one" species wise, and the new Cylon/human hybrids forget their history, make a new generation of Cylon slaves, and the cycle repeats itself, but now if what you've said about Kara is true then that means that the time cycle is much smaller than I imagined, or is it something entirely different?  SPOILER Please setup your reply as a spoiler as I might choose not to read it, but I probably will anyway!  

Arrrgh!  Arrrgh! I say!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 12:42:16 AM
Great, more buns in the Toasters :p
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 14, 2008, 12:45:42 AM
Quote from: Kyle_K_ski;103075
Alright Angelus,

You're driving me crazy man!  If you've got "The Goods" on what's happening, and I don't, then that makes me want to know them when I don't want to know them!  That's an enigma caught in the black hole of a paradox, and my frustration level of wanting something I don't want is making me more frustrated...

And I read your spoiler regarding SPOILER Kara finding her crashed viper with her corpse in it SPOILER, and I didn't want to read that, but I did!  Arrrrrrrrrrgh-gh-GAH!

Then I read your response to my query
 and I started thinking about your last broken statement, and it has my mind racing in all kinds of different directions, and I have to ask is a SPOILER form of time travel involved?  My understanding of the "what's happened before will happen again" line is that the whole cycle of humans build Cylons as slaves, the Cylons revolt, bring each other to the brink of extinction, find out that they're really one and the same, have babies together-actually becoming "one" species wise, and the new Cylon/human hybrids forget their history, make a new generation of Cylon slaves, and the cycle repeats itself, but now if what you've said about Kara is true then that means that the time cycle is much smaller than I imagined, or is it something entirely different?  SPOILER Please setup your reply as a spoiler as I might choose not to read it, but I probably will anyway!  

Arrrgh!  Arrrgh! I say!



I didn't post:[SPOILER]Kara finding her crashed viper with her corpse in it[/SPOILER] it was Elthis.

I'll post [SPOILER] an Spoilerfilled update PROBABLY[/SPOILER] later. ;)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 12:49:23 AM
I see no web broadcast, ok I ate the bait but spit the hook :p
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Elthis on June 14, 2008, 02:38:19 AM
Also, I'd like to state that the music in tonight's episode was incredibly amazing.

Bear really did an amazing job.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 14, 2008, 02:41:23 AM
yes, indeed.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Arch_Angel on June 14, 2008, 02:49:41 AM
HOLY FRAK ! ! !


i wont give up any information on the sudden outburst....i am watching the newest episode of Battlestar Galactica and saw something that made me go and say that out loud while watching the show from my couch. you have to watch it yourselves. but it will be worth your time.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Sparky on June 14, 2008, 03:39:31 AM
Well.... [spoiler]Earth:([/spoiler]

Obviously, it was called Revelations for a reason.

Tori suddenly grew a pair, but in a bad way.

And can Roslin really be the Dying leader afterall, [spoiler] because she made it to the surface alive.  Also, when did everyone have the time to dress up all goth? [/spoiler].

Q: Did Adama screaming and crying like a girl upset anyone.

A: No, because he's Edward Fucking Olmos, that's why.  He can pull it off.

I just wonder what's going to happen now that everyone knows that Tigh, Tyrol and Anders are cylons and that they're still in the fleet.

And one more thing:
[spoiler] Figursky?  WTF?  Lucky dog.[/spoiler]
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: hightailer on June 14, 2008, 03:44:13 AM
this may seem stupid, but honeslty here, do you think that they might have made a huge circle and gone back to caprica. i mean, if you look at the skyline in the distance, it sorta looks like the caprica skyline from the opening credits. it definetly dosent look like anything from earth, at least this time period.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Blue Lion on June 14, 2008, 03:49:17 AM
Didn't one of the actors say something and being in a forest on Earth?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angreifer on June 14, 2008, 03:54:19 AM
As there's two threads about Ep. 12, I'm confused about which one to post in...but I guess this one will do.

As cliffhangers go, this one felt the least painful. Obviously there's the usual "what the frak?" feeling, but I don't quite feel like I'll need to rip my hair out from now until 2009.

Amazing acting from Eddie...was so painful seeing Adama reduced to a worthless, sobbing wreck like that, and that's one of the things I love about the series.

So, the big questions...what the frak happened to Earth? What the frak are they gonna do now? Who the frak is the 5th cylon? And lastly...

Why the frak haven't Saul 'One Eye'd Toaster' Tigh and Felix 'Stumpy' Gaeta formed their pirate gang yet?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 14, 2008, 03:54:33 AM
Quote from: hightailer;103091
this may seem stupid, but honeslty here, do you think that they might have made a huge circle and gone back to caprica. i mean, if you look at the skyline in the distance, it sorta looks like the caprica skyline from the opening credits. it definetly dosent look like anything from earth, at least this time period.


the cylons restored the old colonies. they used the centurions to clean up the bombed out areas and repair everything. we even have seen video with the centurions planting trees in the background. so the old colonies look like they would have pre-holocaust.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 14, 2008, 03:58:25 AM
i liked adama's getting all emotional, he's served with tigh for a long time, and there have been various times where tigh is the only person he trusts and to find out your best, trusted friend is the thing you hate, that would be rough on anyone, it was well done, at least Eddie kicked that mirror's ass
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 04:11:41 AM
Well done episode, but just when things finally get moving....dead space.
Fraks me off so bad the time they put between these so called half seasons.
I just want to break sh$+ and scream FELGERCARB!

I liked the end of the episode with scorched Earth.
Look at what they did to their own worlds S.S.D.D.

I liked the fact they finally worked together.
Two flawed, incredible, and equally barbarous races.
Neither without shame.
What differences truly exist now?
Not enough of either left right now to be so foolish.
Should make an interesting final "Half" a$$ed season.
I don't say that because of the writing or acting.
I say it because of the way commercialization is milking it beyond anything resembling good taste.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 14, 2008, 04:12:50 AM
D'anna sure seems ready to give the final four a great deal of authority. It will be interesting to see how that plays out considering they don't seem know or remember much about themselves. Their past now appears to be a giant ? even to them!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 04:16:22 AM
So Earth gets rebuilt, populated, the colonies live out their shelf life and become habitable again.
They go back, they Hatfield and McCoy their way to another cycle of idiocy and destruction...
OK, time to evolve... yeah right, you should see the idiot I saw at the store this morning...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: zerotonin on June 14, 2008, 04:40:15 AM
This might seem a bit daft, or a bit "already discussed and discounted years ago, noob!!!" but I wouldn't know... anyhoo... mock me if you must, for it is through merciless ridicule that we learn and eventually gain wisdom.

my take is that it is somewhere around 30,000 years in our past (perhaps long enough for the nuclear half-life to wear down). The colonials and the Cylons will have one last slugfest which wipes out nearly all of them in one big nuclear frenzy, and there will be two people left - one human and one cylon, oposite gender, and they will scrape together whatever remaning provisions from the wreckage of their fleet, find a sorry little patch of still fertile soil somewhere near present day Iraq, and they will build a sort of garden / shanty, and start the "human" race... maybe one of them will be Lee Adama (Adam) and the other will be Kara (maybe we find out that her middle name is Eve...? am I on glue?) They will have Hera with them or something. Maybe a few of them, led by Adam(a).

OK, I'm on glue.
It would be kind of cool though, if the ancient and cross-civilisations myth of human kind's progenitors, and the garden, and later the Pantheon of Greek Gods (and their system of government, countless centuries ahead of their time.... or maybe behind, huh?) turn out to have their origins in the last remnants of the 12 colonies of Kobol...

Forgive me if this is a very old idea already discussed to death. I'm relatively new to the show, and totally new to the game / forum.

Best regards,
gabriel

function edit(dumbass:Me):Clue{
   ok, mulled that one over, and realized, "hey, genius.. no 'frakking' animals left, are there?
   human kind is not the only critter on the planet.
   well, it sounded good as it rolled off the top of my brain onto my keyboard earlier,
   but it makes about as much sense as asking my sister's cat for help with trigonometry.
};
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: HotBagel on June 14, 2008, 04:56:50 AM
Quote from: Angreifer;103093
As there's two threads about Ep. 12, I'm confused about which one to post in...but I guess this one will do.


you got the right one, the other one was just pre-game discussion, but here you don't have to use spoiler tags.

Quote
As cliffhangers go, this one felt the least painful. Obviously there's the usual "what the frak?" feeling, but I don't quite feel like I'll need to rip my hair out from now until 2009.


Totally agree.  I was really afraid that they would stop at that stand off, like they have with every fucking stand off since the midseason finale.  This time they left off with closure, yet ended on a somber, sad tone.  Hell towards the end I almost started to wondering whether I was actually watching the final episode of the series.  Definitely the most peaceful season finale of the series, though still not as good as the first finale.

Quote
Amazing acting from Eddie...was so painful seeing Adama reduced to a worthless, sobbing wreck like that, and that's one of the things I love about the series.


true, though none of his smashing can compare to when he first smashed his model boat.  While the acting was good in this episode, I still think the scenes were kind of rushed so that he went through all the stages of grief too quickly within the episode, when in reality it would take someone a lot longer to come to terms with the revelation that someone they had known all their life is actually their sworn enemy.

Quote

So, the big questions...what the frak happened to Earth?


the BIG question.  Whether it was us, Caville, or a previous generation of cylon remains to be seen.  While I didn't notice any recognizable architecture of present or past Earth as we know it, I did notice the collapsed dome of the "Citadel of Aurora" that Starbuck mentioned in the beginning of the episode.  Now as far as I know, there is no such citadel like that on Earth now.  So...either this is Earth in the future, a parallel Earth, or it's part of the ruins of Atlantis and ancient Greece is just over the Atlantic.

Quote
What the frak are they gonna do now?

Well you know they're going to be looking for Caville.  Wonder if Dieana is going to take it personally and try to kill all the Cavilles once and for all.

As for the humans...I'm guessing we might have a situation like that at the beginning of season 3 where most of the action takes place on the surface of the Earth where hopefully they'll piece together what happened.  Then after that the choices will be a) settle on Earth in the places not soaked in radiation, b) focus on eliminating the final cylon threat (Caville) assuming that the alliance cylons give the human's their complete loyalty, or c) ditching the cylon alliance and going back on the road.

Quote
Who the frak is the 5th cylon? And lastly...


After Dieanna's remark that the final one isn't in the fleet, I am more likely to believe that it's somewhere on Earth.  I still doubt it is someone who died in the series unless my suspicion that there is an ancient 2nd generation resurrection ship somewhere is correct, as otherwise the seven would have already had known who the finally one is after emerging from their baths.

Quote
Why the frak haven't Saul 'One Eye'd Toaster' Tigh and Felix 'Stumpy' Gaeta formed their pirate gang yet?


They need a parrot and someone to lose their hand first.  I vote for Starbuck to be Hook.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: HotBagel on June 14, 2008, 05:17:55 AM
Quote from: zerotonin;103100
and there will be two people left - one human and one cylon, oposite gender, and they will scrape together whatever remaning provisions from the wreckage of their fleet, find a sorry little patch of still fertile soil somewhere near present day Iraq, and they will build a sort of garden / shanty, and start the "human" race...


Not a chance, you can't reboot an entire race with just two people.  I couldn't find an immediate source to cite, but trying looking up the subject of Minimum viable population (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_viable_population), Inbreeding (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inbreeding), and human space exploration/extinction.  From what I've heard, you need at least 32 humans, each half of each gender, to have a diverse enough set of genes to restart the human race without the race succumbing to the effects of birth defects and infertility that come with inbreeding.  With less then 32 humans you have a high chance of your race dieing out due to inbreeding.

but hell make one of those mates a cylon and who knows what could happen, as their blood can even cure cancer in a terminally ill patient.  But still, remember the trouble Athena had delivering her baby.  Hopefully the tubing is much better with the hybrid female cylons.

Quote

It would be kind of cool though, if the ancient and cross-civilisations myth of human kind's progenitors, and the garden, and later the Pantheon of Greek Gods turn out to have their origins in the last remnants of the 12 colonies of Kobol...


I'm hoping too so that they can adequately explain how their culture is so heavily influenced by Greek and Norse mythology.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 14, 2008, 05:29:07 AM
And so the story BEGINS!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 14, 2008, 05:59:34 AM
I wondered why they didn't do a two hour?
Especially with the huge gap between eppy's now.
Enough stuff hits the cutting room floor it wouldn't have killed them.
Like I said before, over commercialized use of the show.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Sparky on June 14, 2008, 06:05:04 AM
I also took note that it appears that Adama has run out of ships to smash.

But did anyone notice that D'anna is acting much as she did over the Algae planet?

3: "Adama's bluffing!  I spent all of an hour with him once filming a documentary.    I know him!"
Baltar: "Excuse me, but they brought me, of all people, to point out that you might be making a poor decision..."
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Talchar on June 14, 2008, 06:06:43 AM
I do not recall seeing those cargo/transport craft that we shown flying down to earth before. Could those be the elusive tanker birds craft referenced in exodus?  The protrusions look a lot like fuel booms.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Nuke on June 14, 2008, 06:06:58 AM
looks like the way earth is i seemed to have fulfilled my evil misanthropic plan to destroy the earth. im so clever :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: zerotonin on June 14, 2008, 06:17:39 AM
Quote from: HotBagel;103102

From what I've heard, you need at least 32 humans, each half of each gender, to have a diverse enough set of genes to restart the human race without the race succumbing to the effects of birth defects and infertility that come with inbreeding.  With less then 32 humans you have a high chance of your race dieing out due to inbreeding.
but hell make one of those mates a cylon and who knows what could happen, as their blood can even cure cancer in a terminally ill patient.  But still, remember the trouble Athena had delivering her baby.  Hopefully the tubing is much better with the hybrid female cylons.


heh.. yeah, another hole in my adama and eve / garden theory (or 'down the garden path' theory).

Quote from: HotBagel;103102

I'm hoping too so that they can adequately explain how their culture is so heavily influenced by Greek and Norse mythology.


actually I had always thought the mythology of Kobol came to earth with the 13th colony...
I don't know, the show is full of odd paralels, both hinted at, and some just blatantly obvious, with our ancient history, I had really thought they were going that way. Especially in the first (i think..) episode of season 4 where baltar strikes that pose straight from a byzantine catholic icon :lol: brilliant.
Even his first name is kind of suggestive.

I can't believe how good this show is.... I've never before felt compelled to theorize about a television program!

ok, strike that... once before, with Twin Peaks.
BSG is better.
Title: Revelations (Ep 4x10) Discussion: Warning!!!!! SPOILERS
Post by: macgeek96 on June 14, 2008, 06:21:11 AM
WTF!

The President has gotten even more humane, cylons team up with humans, find earth with radioactive soil and in ruins.  Adama goes crazy when he finds out that Tigh is a cylon.  Young Adama does some amazing negotiation, commented on by the President, and helped along by another weird signal, coming from
Starbuck's viper.  All in all, a crazy episode, with a way too drawn out and
sappy celebration scene.  I wonder what our new cylon and human race will
find out about Earth?  Nuclear War?  The always useful zombie invasion?

And by the way, this may be against your instincts, but HUG CYLONS!!!!!, as they will be living with you for a while now.

Also, Why were there no scenes with the Cylons, except the 5, in the last 5 minutes or so, besides seeing the baseship jump in.  

Only 1 jump! They were right next to it all along.

See you on the new Earth colonies.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: macgeek96 on June 14, 2008, 06:24:22 AM
Quote from: HotBagel;103102
Not a chance, you can't reboot an entire race with just two people.  I couldn't find an immediate source to cite, but trying looking up the subject of Minimum viable population (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_viable_population), Inbreeding (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inbreeding), and human space exploration/extinction.  From what I've heard, you need at least 32 humans, each half of each gender, to have a diverse enough set of genes to restart the human race without the race succumbing to the effects of birth defects and infertility that come with inbreeding.  With less then 32 humans you have a high chance of your race dieing out due to inbreeding.

but hell make one of those mates a cylon and who knows what could happen, as their blood can even cure cancer in a terminally ill patient.  But still, remember the trouble Athena had delivering her baby.  Hopefully the tubing is much better with the hybrid female cylons.



I'm hoping too so that they can adequately explain how their culture is so heavily influenced by Greek and Norse mythology.
not to mention genetic diversity
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 14, 2008, 10:00:59 AM
Was that new york? I'm no american but that bridge looked familiar.

Plus: We finally got some decent reference shots of the cylon freighter not seen since s1.

Neg: We're all dead.

I guess the quote is:

Where do we go now?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 14, 2008, 10:03:07 AM
There is already 2 threads, let's keep the discussion to them please.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 14, 2008, 10:14:21 AM
Quote from: Talchar;103109
I do not recall seeing those cargo/transport craft that we shown flying down to earth before. Could those be the elusive tanker birds craft referenced in exodus?  The protrusions look a lot like fuel booms.


Plus: We finally got some decent reference shots of the cylon freighter not seen since s1.

Neg: We're all dead.

I guess the quote is:

Where do we go now?

Was that new york? I'm no american but that bridge looked familiar.

And to answer the opening post: I'm already insane.

Edit: That looks suspiciously like the brooklyn bridge.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 14, 2008, 11:13:23 AM
Quote from: hightailer;103091
this may seem stupid, but honeslty here, do you think that they might have made a huge circle and gone back to caprica. i mean, if you look at the skyline in the distance, it sorta looks like the caprica skyline from the opening credits. it definetly dosent look like anything from earth, at least this time period.


Apart from the fact it's New York City? A friend of mine who lives in Brooklyn said the way they set out the shot made it look like views of Manhatten you could get from the Brooklyn Heights (presumably without the Temple of Aurora), plus the ruins in the distance were on an island with a wide river around them with what looked very much like the lower half of one of the Brooklyn Bridge supporting arches.

Quote from: HotBagel;103102
but hell make one of those mates a cylon and who knows what could happen, as their blood can even cure cancer in a terminally ill patient.


But the cancer came back, which is hardly a success story ;)

Quote from: Talchar;103109
I do not recall seeing those cargo/transport craft that we shown flying down to earth before. Could those be the elusive tanker birds craft referenced in exodus?  The protrusions look a lot like fuel booms.


Those cargo transporters have been around since S1, most clearly seen lifting off from New Caprica in Exodus, Part 2.

Quote
Only 1 jump! They were right next to it all along.


The impression I got was that the Fleet and the basestar had to do multiple jumps to get there, and then Roslin gave the order for the final jump to Earth. Also remember that the Cylon basestar can plot much longer jumps than the Galactica can, so the journey would have been shorter than if they'd done it by themselves (the impression I'm getting is that there is absolutely no limit to where you can jump to in the universe, only a limit on how far you can plot such a jump before you hit the red line and all the variables can no longer be accounted for). Although perhaps Adama wouldn't have given the basestar the jump coordinates in case they shot off by themselves and left the fleet trailing behind.

So what happens next? Questions left unanswered:

Who is the Final Cylon?
Where are Team Cavil and co?
Who are the Head-People-Things?
What happens to the fleet? Are parts of Earth still habitable? Or are they just royally screwed?
Did Earth have time to settle colonies of its own before whatever happened happened?
Who is the 'higher power' orchestrating things? Why did he/she/it want the fleet to go to Earth if it's just a wasteland?
How did a Colonial transponder get to Earth? Why can only Starbuck's Viper pick it up?
What's the deal with Starbuck what happened to her in the maelstrom? How did she come back from the dead?
What is the significance of the Opera House and the visions therein?
What is the significance of Hera?

Finally, Bear McCreary on how he came up with (http://www.bearmccreary.com/blog/?p=396) the music in the episode.

Season 4.5 trailer. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5WPM_obGic&eurl=http://galacticasitrep.blogspot.com/)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: newman on June 14, 2008, 11:22:20 AM
Charlton Heston is the final Cylon. In the last episode, he screams at a broken statue of liberty..  "they blew it up! the maniacs!"
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 14, 2008, 11:39:15 AM
(http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/913/bsgbrooklynbridgeyx0.jpg)

Looks like the Brooklyn Bridge to me. The perspective is a bit off on Manhattan though.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 14, 2008, 11:57:35 AM
edie: nevermind
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 14, 2008, 01:17:42 PM
yeah werthead thats the same image I found. I made the connection straight away, and I'm an aussie. Only problem is, if it is the brooklyn bridge, each image is looking from the other end. One of the bridge struts is in the water, the other end isn't.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Apocalypsse on June 14, 2008, 03:08:54 PM
LOL we totally nuked ourselves, gogo nuclear winter! Cant wait to see where they go with this now.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 14, 2008, 05:34:08 PM
I went from "FUCK YEAH!" to "FUCK NO!" in about 5 seconds.

That's my indepth media analysis of this episode, thankyou very much for reading.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 14, 2008, 05:39:36 PM
Enki did it.....
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 14, 2008, 05:44:52 PM
I'm just hoping the next episode in 2009 starts with a chipper joke from our resident "Brit in a sea of Yankees", Gaius Baltar.

Everyone else is staring at the radioactive wasteland, when...

"My planet was better."
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lancer on June 14, 2008, 05:53:14 PM
well I wouldn't say they were totally screwed.

um thoughts first....when the shot pans you can see buildings partially submerged which means either a nuke has created a crater, or the sea level has risen. You can hear the surf crashing by the temple. yet in the book of Pythia which Lee is reading at the beginning shows buildings all around the temple and no river so the topography has obviously changed in the intervening time period.

could it be New York? maybe

where do they go from here. well kobol is habitable. not glow in the dark and they know it can support life. If everything has been patched up with these cylons, then lets all go to Kobol, twelve tribes of man, 1 tribe of cylons. live in harmony on kobol. and let the cycle begin all over again.

the cylons are the 13th tribe!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 14, 2008, 06:11:42 PM
maybe not screwed, but their will be mass depression!!!!!!! Everyone going to think that life sucks

while looking for Earth their was hope!
Now there is nothing., "WTF do we do now......Kobol......New Caprica.....Caprica"
Everything is FUBAR.

Unless its not earth, but actually Mars..........thousands and thousands of years ago....
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 14, 2008, 06:29:15 PM
Quote from: Angelus;103069
The prophecy says: ...the leader suffered a wasting disease and would not live to enter the new land

I think they are referring to the phrase: this all has happened before, this all will happen again, that's what ... meant as he talked with ... .


Sry, no spoilers.


It doesn't say the new land is Earth.  Earth being all screwed up can't be the new land they will settle on.  You have to remember the screwy ways religious prophecies are presented.  Lots of ambiguity so that the "unchosen" don't correctly decipher it.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 14, 2008, 07:03:15 PM
Quote from: TESLA;103149
Enki did it.....

Not me.  My little robotic minions.  They got tired of the same old same old missing of the clues so they decided to start over.  Oh, that and they had a distinct desire to eradicate all memory of some half-assed idea called The Singularity.

I got no spoilers, but this is roughly playing out as I have speculated for the past 2 years.

The inhabitants of Kobol left earth because Earth became uninhabitable at some point.  I guess we have some confirmation of that now.

Kobol took several thousand years to get fully established to the point that power politics once again put the entire planet in jeopardy.  So the colonists predecessors left Kobol amid the cataclysm.  

The 13th tribe who may have either been losers or just fed up with the others decided to go a different direction and go back to Earth.  At that point they knew which way to go, but left a crumb-trail to show their path should someone wish to follow them later.  You can sprinkle all kinds of religious sugar into that process and gussie it up for story line.

The five are of Earth, the Hybrid did not say from Earth.  If they can trace their lineage back to Kobol cyborg progenitors they would have been of those that came from Earth. Quite ancient roots and around long enough to account for their influence in many disparate events.  Maybe even inadvertently starting the First Cylon War.  A little thin - sure.

So now we have to ask where did the 13th tribe go if they aren't on Earth?  Hmmm.  What a thing to explore during season 4.5! Eventually the RTF my find a new land - after Roslin dies - and reunite with the 13th tribe bringing the cycle to closure.









Or would it.











Would that be the moment Cavils band shows up and nukes a wonderfully advanced planet to nuclear contaminated waste?  Or did that happen a good 10-12 thousand years ago with the original Earth?

Because who says Earth did it to itself?  Maybe Earth died because human and cyborg didn't join forces to become collectively strong enough to repulse the pissed of kids returning home last time around?

Did Lee's Olive Branch break the cycle?  Does Roland finally get to the Dark Tower with his Sigul?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lepton on June 14, 2008, 07:18:56 PM
Quote from: Werthead;103131
(http://img406.imageshack.us/img406/913/bsgbrooklynbridgeyx0.jpg)

Looks like the Brooklyn Bridge to me. The perspective is a bit off on Manhattan though.
Nice Find.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 14, 2008, 07:28:41 PM
i'll be brief.. Remarkable show!.

Quote
...there has been recent talk about producing up to 3 more Battlestar Galactica television movies which could be produced and air before (or possibly after) Season 4's remaining episodes are released...


Anyways, is going to be a long haul until the final half of the show gets aired.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lepton on June 14, 2008, 07:36:36 PM
Well, finally an episode where something happens and it means something.  It was a great episode that did not require stuff getting blown up, one-off red herrings, misdirections, and hoodwinks that can be taken back at a moment's notice, or lots of people dying or getting shot.

For all those who called that Earth would have been devastated by a war, a la Planet of the Apes, you get the prize.  It seems we are really going to be hit over the head with the notion that war is bad, especially nuclear war.  Ah, DUH!!!  I wonder if the nuclear bombardment of 12 planets full of people was not enough to illustrate that.

It's really an amazing pay-off though after all this swirling around the bowl that had been happening since episode one of this new season.  Too bad this wasn't done maybe five episodes ago.  Now they have half a season to somehow get the cylons and humans working together for real or some such without it feeling rushed or whatever the ultimate conclusion is. I hope that they have the time to pull it off.

Things I thought were dumb:

Adama breaking down after being told by Tigh.  FTW!  Adama needs to get a grip.  I am glad that they are letting Almos spread his acting wings, but for the Gods' sake Kara has has a Cylon inside her to put it bluntly and she isn't going apeshit.  It seemed a bit over the top.

D'Anna hostage situation was kind of nonsensical.  If she believed the Four were embracing their cylonness enough to want to come to them, why would they give a rat's ass if she started spacing humans?  And if it was to pressure the humans, well, it was clear to her and everyone else that the humans did not know who the four were.  So, she had to be betting that the Four were "human" enough to care what happened to other humans, but if they were that "human", why would she want them??  It seemed a little odd to me.  I get the hostage taking.  That makes sense, but the conditions that brought it about and the demands and motivations did not.

All in all though a great episode, about a month too late but hey, at least we are here now.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on June 14, 2008, 07:37:40 PM
Of course, the question is why did they land there? If that is the Temple of Aurora, then perhaps the Colonial beacon is located there and that's what they homed in on? Of course, it's a bit cheesy that Starbuck and Lee were looking at the book just a few days earlier, but WTH?  My guess is that the beacon takes us into Season 4.5 and puts on a collision with the reveal of the Final Cylon, which in turn may also spark a whole load of revelations about the Head-People, the Final Five and their origins, and the final showdown with Cavill (which I'm guessing is the ultimate final battle of the series).

Assuming the major cities were the ones nuked, it's also possible that other parts of the planet are still habitable. Unless the Earth was totally irradiated by thousands or tens of thousands of nuclear detonations, which is possible (if unlikely).

Also, if this is near-future Earth (say 100-200 years into the future), that puts the 13th Tribe landing on Earth in around 2000 BC, which obviously means that Earth was inhabited by humans long before they arrived, so perhaps it is the original homeworld. I think RDM was asked ages ago about the fossil record proving that humans originated on Earth and he acknowledged that is something they've discussed in the writer's room.

If the 13th Tribe did arrive on Earth in 2000 BC though, what happened to them? Did they go to ground in Greece and become the ancestors of the Hellenistic civilisation? Then why is there a temple to Aurora in NYC in the near-future? Did Earth nuke itself and then the 13th Tribe turned up and settle the planet? How did they survive the radiation? Then where is the 13th now? And why are the ruins of NYC still there? They wouldn't be recognisable after 4,000+ years.

A lot of questions to be answered next year...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lepton on June 14, 2008, 08:04:43 PM
Ah, and one other thing.  Are you telling me that there isn't one prosthesis in the entire fleet of a civilization that has faster than light travel???  Yes, we know Gaeta had his leg cut off.  Got it.  Now do something that makes sense, like giving the character a F'ing fake leg.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 14, 2008, 08:18:23 PM
He needs a peg leg to go with Tigh's eyepatch.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 14, 2008, 08:26:06 PM
Quote from: Lepton;103177
Ah, and one other thing.  Are you telling me that there isn't one prosthesis in the entire fleet of a civilization that has faster than light travel???  Yes, we know Gaeta had his leg cut off.  Got it.  Now do something that makes sense, like giving the character a F'ing fake leg.


You can't fit a prosthesis until all the swelling has gone down end the nervous damage has healed over.  It can be a couple months before that is a option, depending on the person.  So a dramatic reminder of his lost leg isn't exactly as frakked up as you decided it should be.

I am amazed though that you didn't post a long thesis on why the overall episode and writing was trash though.  Are you mellowing on your old age???  :lol:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Toffelieläin on June 14, 2008, 08:41:36 PM
I cried at the end. I just could'nt help myself.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Blue Lion on June 14, 2008, 08:43:29 PM
On a side note, Tigh should be given the biggest medal they have.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: joncfc on June 14, 2008, 08:52:33 PM
just downloaded it

top episode, looks like the yanks are finally starting to make good sci fi

now is there any chance of you btrl devs releasing another demo to tide us over?

no?


oh...


:blah:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Tikey on June 14, 2008, 08:54:07 PM
Quote from: Blue Lion;103184
On a side note, Tigh should be given the biggest medal they have.


I was disappointed for not seeing him in the CIC when they made the jump.
The man was willing to jump from an airlock to save the people on the basestar.

An amazing episode.

BTW, the final cylon is Dirk Benedict
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 14, 2008, 09:40:12 PM
Werthead,

Your summation of sub-questions regarding the history of Earth, and the 13th Tribe was extremely well thought out, and thorough.  I'm happy that you went through the trouble of spelling it out here.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: combat on June 14, 2008, 09:51:00 PM
I don't think its earth. The book of pythia (or whatever) said "their leader sufered from a wasting disease and wounld not live to enter the new land" Royslin is on the planet there fore she has entered the new land.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 14, 2008, 10:10:16 PM
You're assuming that passage literally means "Roslin won't live to set foot on Earth".

Religious mumbo-jumbo is usually a lot less literal than that. I'm guessing the writers have made the decision that it would be better for the show if she lived through the initial "well, we're fucked" of discovering Earth, but dies before seeing the next stage of humanitys journey.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 14, 2008, 10:11:28 PM
..Tigh has his pre-final award though. No CIC but an all Cylon model 6 in exclusive. So.. screw the CIC!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Lepton on June 14, 2008, 10:36:46 PM
Quote from: Enki;103179
You can't fit a prosthesis until all the swelling has gone down end the nervous damage has healed over.  It can be a couple months before that is a option, depending on the person.  So a dramatic reminder of his lost leg isn't exactly as frakked up as you decided it should be.

I am amazed though that you didn't post a long thesis on why the overall episode and writing was trash though.  Are you mellowing on your old age???  :lol:

Ah. that explains things.  Thank you for that.  And, no, when something is good. it is good.  When the writing sucks, it sucks.  The writing and the pacing in this episode were excellent and that's because they pulled in one of A writing teams as opposed to some PA turned story editor and writing assistant that wrote an episode like "Faith".
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 14, 2008, 10:37:33 PM
Quote from: combat;103199
I don't think its earth. The book of pythia (or whatever) said "their leader sufered from a wasting disease and wounld not live to enter the new land" Royslin is on the planet there fore she has entered the new land.


was it ever stated the New Land was Earth? i mean, the characters beleived it, most the fans, myself included beleive it, but now i think the New Land may be somewhere else.

Anyway, the dieing leader needs to find out the truth of the Opera House, or somthing

edit: For once, i can agree with Lipton aabout wether or not an episode was good? we've broken the cycle of "This has happened before and will happened again"!!!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Fergus on June 14, 2008, 10:53:41 PM
So many good things to say about the episode, but I'll just point out my favourite little touch.
Laura informs Baltar of her back-up plan to destroy the Basestar
Baltar:You what?
Perfect and oh so typical reaction
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: YIIMM on June 14, 2008, 11:40:53 PM
I spent the last ten minutes reciting "Oh my God" over and over again.


The sad thing is, it's how I always imagined Earth would look.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: macgeek96 on June 15, 2008, 12:43:59 AM
good episode:

Cylons come out: the scene when baltar finds out who the first 5 is is priceless: "I always knew, It was something about you"  

Also the reaction Adama had when he found out that Tigh was a cylon, great acting.

Even more humane actions from our old hard president ie. her complment to Adama on the great job he did while she was gone.

And I though it was really funny when Baltar thanked Roslin for not killing him,  total Baltar, only worried about himself.

Earth's a wreck, with radioactive soil, evident from the geiger counter chirping in the first view of earth.  Nuclear war? or A zombie invasion?  It would be a crazy twist if this series just turns into another zombie flick.

Anyway, good episode, besides the drawn out and sappy celebration scene, and I can't wait to see what happens next.

See you on the earth colony!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 15, 2008, 01:04:22 AM
I just can't believe how amazing Micheal Hogan was in this episode. Phenomenal actor.

Aaron Douglas is also great. He appears to have accepted that his life is one steaming bag of shite after another, to the point where he's fucking laughing to himself when he sees how Earth is. I wonder if that was in the script or if he added it himself; either way it's indicative of just how much detail goes into this show.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 15, 2008, 01:55:46 AM
agreed crixx, great acting from both of them, and saw what makes tigh great. looking back to him killing ellen for what she did, and then willing willing to step into that airlock and almost begging apollo space him.  Then when the marines came to get anders and tyrol and he laughed a bit there as if he'd been waiting for that and it was a relief to have it over with.

Really liked the airlock sequence, especially tyrols nod to tigh as the door closes, a lot of respect involved and they are still good people despite being what the colonials have hated for years.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Arch_Angel on June 15, 2008, 01:58:36 AM
i am going to go out on a limb here and say some of my my theories on this......

that is not earth or not the earth that they are looking for ? this is yet another step to get to earth. like those other places they went to and had gotten clues to get to earth. or it might be a dream while they are in that long extended FTL jump to get to earth...a nightmare of sorts where what they find isnt what they had hopes of finding.....?

perhaps it is part of the prophecy in which the dying leader saves humanity like ordering a time travel jump maybe ? or maybe somehow they discover something that will let them go back in time to prevent the destruction of earth and save humanity and find the 13th tribe and united mankind. remember the prophecy said a dying leader would guide the survivors of the colonies to the 13th tribe and reunite humanity..... this has to mean something.

maybe this is earth but the 13th tribe had moved on after the destruction and the survivors of the comlonies will go to that new place where the 13th tribe is now living. it can be yet another stepping stone on the way to reuniting the 12 colonies with the 13th tribe.

maybe the cylons are the 13th tribe ? and they find an earth of sorts and have to co-exist together and then make something of it ?

so many questions so little hints and tidbits to carry us over until next weeks episode. i cant wait for the next 5 days to go by to get to next weeks episode to see what happens next.


side note :
by the way check out my avatar. it is the Cylon Basestar Phoenix Logo representing the new Cylon squadron i created. i will have the website up soon. had some trouble with setting it up and getting everything working just right. but as in the search for earth....good things come in time and with perseverance.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 15, 2008, 02:03:17 AM
It's Earth. Stop wishing.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Arch_Angel on June 15, 2008, 02:12:25 AM
this season will be nonstop. it was stated it would be a 20 or so episode season to finish off everything and tie it all together. so why not just wait and see and watch..............
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 15, 2008, 02:21:36 AM
um... no. this season is going to split up just like the others, it won't be nonstop. We wont get the last half of the season till later.

"The fourth season has been rumored to be split into two parts, a case more likely given the late premiere and production delays caused by the 2007-2008 writers' strike; the first 10 episodes airing beginning April 4, 2008 with the second 10 installments possibly airing as late as 2009."

"(according to various people on the red carpet, the show will return January or February of 2009, but a date has yet to be determined)" http://popwatch.ew.com/popwatch/2008/06/screening-and-p.html
 (http://popwatch.ew.com/popwatch/2008/06/screening-and-p.html)
sorry we have to wait as usual
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 15, 2008, 02:33:22 AM
On the Earth or not debate:
The constellations matched. So unless they were stupid enough to land on a terraformed Mars while the real Earth is one planet closer to the sun, I'm pretty sure it has to be Earth. (<-Obviously not even an option, both in that being that stupid and the terraformed Mars)

As Cl1nt said, get over it, its Earth.
Besides anyone else think that was supposed to be either mainland NYC or perhaps Oakland looking at San Francisco? The whole bridge to the right could be the Golden Gate. The island seemed too wide to be SF though, and it could be any bridge.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Vektram on June 15, 2008, 02:41:39 AM
My current ideas:

1. Roslin is not the dying leader. Starbuck is, this would fit with her "special destiny" and her paintings of the eye, which to me are far more indicative of a prophet than drug induced visions.

2. Galactica is a cylon. This is a bit far-flung, but fits in to the general wtf of the show. Rather than having a hybrid, the ship itself has a mind. It's behind the music and so on. However, seems to have been disproved by the "there are 4 in your fleet" comment. However D'anna could be lying, I always thought they needed the 5 to find Earth.

As for what's going to happen next: 'Earth' and 'New Land' don't mean the same thing. They've found Earth, but it's a big planet and they have yet to find the New Land. They're in New York (that bridge shot wouldn't have been put in for no reason) and need to find the 'truth of the opera house' which should point them in the right direction.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: blackdeath on June 15, 2008, 03:28:06 AM
Maybe the dying leader was Natalie?

She was all about finding Earth and the Final Five, but died just a few episodes.

Anybody seen the 4.5 preview videos yet? Tigh pulls a gun on Adama... Someone burning the Scriptures... Adama crying over someone's dead body - probably Roslin... and "You're the fifth," spoken in what sounds like Lee's voice.

Frakkin' six months.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 15, 2008, 04:05:24 AM
Quote from: blackdeath;103232
Maybe the dying leader was Natalie?

She was all about finding Earth and the Final Five, but died just a few episodes.

Anybody seen the 4.5 preview videos yet? Tigh pulls a gun on Adama... Someone burning the Scriptures... Adama crying over someone's dead body - probably Roslin... and "You're the fifth," spoken in what sounds like Lee's voice.

Frakkin' six months.


The dying leader is supposed to have a wasting disease.  You would have to stretch that one to saying Natalie was wasted by Athena and died of the disease lead poisoning.  Doesn't work so well with the scrolls, does it?

The mind numbingly simple explanation is Earth is not the 'new land'.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: noVus on June 15, 2008, 04:40:15 AM
Quote from: Josh_88;103229
um... no. this season is going to split up just like the others, it won't be nonstop. We wont get the last half of the season till later.

"The fourth season has been rumored to be split into two parts, a case more likely given the late premiere and production delays caused by the 2007-2008 writers' strike; the first 10 episodes airing beginning April 4, 2008 with the second 10 installments possibly airing as late as 2009."

"(according to various people on the red carpet, the show will return January or February of 2009, but a date has yet to be determined)" http://popwatch.ew.com/popwatch/2008/06/screening-and-p.html
 (http://popwatch.ew.com/popwatch/2008/06/screening-and-p.html)
sorry we have to wait as usual


I'm to the point, that I'm not even sure why we are calling this a 'mid-season break'.  A season doesn't last a fraking year.  Why don't we just start calling last nights episode: The season four finale. And call the 2009 episodes: Season five. I mean honestly. What is a season? Heck, I decided to look it up in wikipedia.

"North Americans call a short run lasting less than a year a season"

Since the new episodes do not come out until 2009 - why are we deluding ourselves into thinking that this is anything less than the end of the season?

Because god knows that cliffhanger sure as heck did deliver like a season finale.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Nuke on June 15, 2008, 04:52:02 AM
im used to mid season breaks lasting a couple months at most, the way cable networks do things is rather odd.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Tikey on June 15, 2008, 05:27:45 AM
Please, stop talking about time travel.
Not only it's incongruent with the works of the show but, except a few times in the history of science fiction, it's plain stupid.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 15, 2008, 05:33:31 AM
I used to get a kick out of 7 days. :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 15, 2008, 06:06:07 AM
still love 7 days haha. was a great show.


with the break being so long thats part of why they call the season chunks 2.0 and 2.5 and so on, because in effect its two mini-seasons.   while the break makes the season last more then a year, if the 20 episodes played from beginning to end with no stop it would be "a short run lasting less than a year" hence still calling it one season
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Ontario334 on June 15, 2008, 07:57:20 AM
Long time lurker who wanted to help with settling the big question.

[spoiler]
I took this screencap when I realized that their inbound trajectory was taking them... over the Caribbean, towards East Coast USA, most likely NYC, indeed.

Standard Link for the spoiler averse: http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/7955/proofth4.jpg

Florida is clearly visible, as is New Jersey's odd shape. A river valley can be spotted that I would argue is the Hudson. Admittedly it looks like Long Island has been wiped out in the nuclear annihilation (Thank God). The Gulf of Mexico is also clearly visible, as is what would be Texas. That being said there are still some inconsistencies.


There is a very cute irony to them landing at Ellis Island, if that is the case.
[/spoiler]
-Zephyr
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 15, 2008, 08:44:36 AM
Quote
3: "Adama's bluffing! I spent all of an hour with him once filming a documentary. I know him!"
Baltar: "Excuse me, but they brought me, of all people, to point out that you might be making a poor decision..."


:lol:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: joncfc on June 15, 2008, 09:32:18 AM
Quote from: Rauko;103230
On the Earth or not debate:
The constellations matched. So unless they were stupid enough to land on a terraformed Mars while the real Earth is one planet closer to the sun, I'm pretty sure it has to be Earth. (<-Obviously not even an option, both in that being that stupid and the terraformed Mars)

As Cl1nt said, get over it, its Earth.
Besides anyone else think that was supposed to be either mainland NYC or perhaps Oakland looking at San Francisco? The whole bridge to the right could be the Golden Gate. The island seemed too wide to be SF though, and it could be any bridge.


earth is fine,  they have just landed in hull

humberside always looks like that

(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.enefer/newholland/HumBrmay00.jpg)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Malmer on June 15, 2008, 10:53:09 AM
So... it took 10 episodes to find out that Starbuck's Viper - last season's episode - picks up a carrier wave. No frakkin' need for a Cylon civil war, the quest for the final five, etc.

I'm in the dark here...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 15, 2008, 01:40:46 PM
Quote from: Malmer;103254
So... it took 10 episodes to find out that Starbuck's Viper - last season's episode - picks up a carrier wave. No frakkin' need for a Cylon civil war, the quest for the final five, etc.

I'm in the dark here...

They said something changed. So it hadn't been like that. Until this episode.
My guess is the 5th Cylon installed it, knowingly or not. And then triggered a signal to bring the other 4 to it.

@Dying leader discussion: Hybrid said the Dying leader would discover the truth about the Opera House. Natalie didn't discover the truth as far as I know, and so that leaves Roslin (with an I, not a Y) and maybe Starbuck if you want to go with that. However, Starbuck has already been given another title of harbinger of doom, so it seems...wrong that she'd be the dying leader as well. Starbuck might be let into the whole Opera house thing, but for now she isn't and that doesn't add up either.

Did anyone catch more about what Dianna said to Adama about the 5 on the fleet? Did she say the 5th is NOT on the fleet, or was she just saying she didn't want the 5 on the fleet, she wanted the 4? If she said or suggested the 5th is not in the Fleet...thats kind of odd.

I'd say the 5th must be on the Galactica at the time of this whole thing since someone needed to do something to Starbuck's Viper.
So does that rule out all the humans on the Basestar?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 15, 2008, 02:27:32 PM
Quote from: joncfc;103252
earth is fine,  they have just landed in hull

humberside always looks like that


ROTFLMAO.

I lived in Hull for seven years and I'm tempted to agree but for the fact that none of the characters are sniffing the air and saying "What is that smell!"
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 15, 2008, 03:34:51 PM
Quote from: Rauko;103230
On the Earth or not debate:
The constellations matched. So unless they were stupid enough to land on a terraformed Mars while the real Earth is one planet closer to the sun, I'm pretty sure it has to be Earth. (<-Obviously not even an option, both in that being that stupid and the terraformed Mars)

As Cl1nt said, get over it, its Earth.
Besides anyone else think that was supposed to be either mainland NYC or perhaps Oakland looking at San Francisco? The whole bridge to the right could be the Golden Gate. The island seemed too wide to be SF though, and it could be any bridge.


umm, you might want to start reading this thread form the start, theres a comparison picture of Manhattan with a shot fromt he show, its defienatly New York.

And to all those that think its Mars, it isnt, also go look at the picture and realise its new york.

Also Rauko, if you look back a few pages, youl find the whole "Final cylon is not int he fleet thing", as well as a list of characters that where in the baseship.

This may sound like a rant, but it isnt, its just saying why you should really read an entire thread (this one isnt even that long). And i was nice enough to post the findings for you in the thread instead of saying "Read Back" :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: The Saint on June 15, 2008, 03:57:36 PM
This might be a crazy idea, but considering that all 4 years of BSG has been filmed in British Columbia (Canada), I don't suppose they could've landed in, well... Vancouver? We've got strait-spanning bridges, too. It's probably Lion's Gate. Would fit the general motif of Caprica being Vancouver, Kobol being Vancouver, New Caprica being Vancouver, etc...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 15, 2008, 05:08:47 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;103261
And to all those that think its Mars, it isnt, also go look at the picture and realise its new york.

Maybe they simply used a picture of New York when making it and it's not actually meant to be New York. Cause it's the sort of thing effects people do all the time. They still don't realise that sci-fi is watched by nerds who sooner or later will notice that they did it.

Saying that the city must be New York simply because it looks a lot like it is about as logical as claiming that their must be a super-sized Galactica class battlestar just cause we saw one in Razor. For an encore you might as well claim the show is in the same universe as Firefly and Star Trek since we've seen ships from that show in the mini-series too.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: lightswitchenator on June 15, 2008, 05:09:54 PM
The CGI before BSG jumps to earth, shows all the ships left over and a star blazing light at them, reminds me of a pic i saw off of sci-fi meshes, forgive low quality, took these screenshots off a streaming website whilst at work

unfortunately, panning was pretty awful on the streaming video
(http://i32.tinypic.com/2vngluf.jpg)

The concept art: http://www.scifi-meshes.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/2313
(http://i32.tinypic.com/2qxq4n6.jpg)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 15, 2008, 05:30:57 PM
I liked when they finished the jump to Earth.
They had the Galactica jump in with a slight roll.
With all of the ships so tightly bunched in the shot though it looked close to being a dangerous roll.

It's Earth. For it not to be would be a cheap shot by the writers in any effect afterwards.
Plus it is the dark edge I like from the series.
Otherwise would be getting too hokey.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Da_Vamp on June 15, 2008, 06:12:55 PM
Quote from: Vektram;103231
My current ideas:

However, seems to have been disproved by the "there are 4 in your fleet" comment. However D'anna could be lying, I always thought they needed the 5 to find Earth.

the fifth was among the hostages... :doubtful:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 15, 2008, 06:32:40 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;103261
umm, you might want to start reading this thread form the start, theres a comparison picture of Manhattan with a shot fromt he show, its defienatly New York.

And to all those that think its Mars, it isnt, also go look at the picture and realise its new york.

Also Rauko, if you look back a few pages, youl find the whole "Final cylon is not int he fleet thing", as well as a list of characters that where in the baseship.

This may sound like a rant, but it isnt, its just saying why you should really read an entire thread (this one isnt even that long). And i was nice enough to post the findings for you in the thread instead of saying "Read Back" :D


Its true I did miss a few pages there (must have bee 4-5)

However, lots of people are claiming that she said the 5th is not on Galactica, but what I was asking was if anyone knew what she said. Not what they think she meant. I'm looking for actual quote. Because what I DID hear was worded very oddly and within its whole context she might not actually mean what everyone is outright accepting. No one quoted, they just stated "she said the 5th isnt..."
I know its a small difference, but I really would prefer to have a more thorough proof on that topic than 3-4 mentions and statements with no citation. I'm going to go back and re-watch that whole scene before I go any further with it. Was just checking in case someone else had something definitive to quote me.

Plus, I was more concerned with how such a statement, if true, would explain how Starbuck's Viper got changed.
On that point, I was thinking about it and I don't think the reciever that we see is unique, I think most ships have them, we just haven't seen them. Just the way that Lee says that all the other ships aren't picking it up, but this one does. So perhaps nothing really changed hardware wise, its just that this one is picking up a signal that the others can't. Perhaps a small software tweek, or it was always present but they were finally close enough to Earth for it to pick it up?

And on the NYC thing, I think Kara has a point.
Most obvious problem with the pictures is that there is a pylon foundation in the middle of the water in the BSG picture and the pylon we do see looks like it is right on the edge of the land. Well the Brooklyn bridge's mainland side pylon is actually out in the water a bit and the Manhattan side is very close to the land, so that doesn't add up at all. Higher water levels don't explain those two combined details.
Also it pans wide enough that we should have seen something of the Manhattan bridge, though there is what looks like maybe a second pylon foundation out there that may fit (again odd position in the water though).

Thats why I think Kara is on the right track.
Its close to something familiar which leaves us all thinking its our Earth and all freaking out, yet its not exactly right so they can say it is something/somewhere other than NYC and still be ok. Very convenient for them :)

I think we can all agree that overall it looks like Earth not too far from our own time, just in ruins.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 15, 2008, 06:45:22 PM
At least it wasn't totally wasted.
There should be resources available and of course less populated, not attacked area's that are habitable enough to quit running for now right?
No need for Cylon occupation nonsense and militarized cluster frak's to start happening.
People could actually start settling in and mining the rubble for clues as well as resources.
Let alone finally have some space of their own.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 15, 2008, 06:45:32 PM
Ok watched and transcripted. (watched several times actually)

The exchange is:

Roslin: Then we will return your final 5 to you (cut off by D'Anna)
D'Anna: Four. There are four in your fleet.
R: Four...wheres the fifth?
D: I want the four in your fleet.

I encourage you to watch the scene yourself as D'Anna's tone makes a great difference. She has a correcting tone when Roslin says five and she said there are four in your fleet.
But then when Roslin asks where the fifth is D'Anna puts a lot of emphasis on "Want"
Tried to edit the transcription to reflect the flow and tone as best I could.

Like I said from the start, I think there are two equally viable ways of hearing it.
1) There are only four in your fleet that I want. Doesn't mean the 5th isn't in the Fleet, just means I only want 4 of them.
2) There are only four in total in your fleet and I want all of them. The 5th is somewhere else.

If you just read the transcription it definitely looks like #2, so please don't jump all over me until you watch it yourself and listen to D'Anna's tone. Then you'll understand why #1 is possible. You might still disagree, but I think its possible.

I really can't decide on either one, so I'm just not going to try and make any conclusion based off it like who can or can't be the 5th. Just thought I'd share this to the community.

EDIT: Recorded the audio of the conversation. If that is improper in some way (legally?) please remove it.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 15, 2008, 07:07:16 PM
Quote from: karajorma;103268
Maybe they simply used a picture of New York when making it and it's not actually meant to be New York. Cause it's the sort of thing effects people do all the time. They still don't realise that sci-fi is watched by nerds who sooner or later will notice that they did it.

Saying that the city must be New York simply because it looks a lot like it is about as logical as claiming that their must be a super-sized Galactica class battlestar just cause we saw one in Razor. For an encore you might as well claim the show is in the same universe as Firefly and Star Trek since we've seen ships from that show in the mini-series too.


Thats true I guess.

We might start seeing interviews within a few weeks where RDM states that is Easrth, or states it 'Might be Earth'.

And even if that is a terraformed Mars or Venus then a human race advanced enough to terraform, would most likely be able to come back and clean up the damage, unless theyve been wiped out by the same problem too. so either way is no humans left.

btw, in theory,  clean up would be done via re teraforming, seeming that should get rid of the radiation.

By the way, allt he above is still only my personal beleif. As far as im concerned there either on our Earth OR there on a different Earth in a seperate solar system which is from the whole "This has happened before and will happen again" thing

Rauko: 3 does say "There are four in your fleet", which i take to means, There are 4 in the human fleet, but it could be RDM trying to make us dig deeper i guess
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 15, 2008, 07:33:08 PM
Rauko,

I appreciate the great lengths that you went through to try and understand the dialog that was spoken.  But having listened to your audio recording of it, I can come to only one conclusion: Out of the 5 Unknown Cylons, 4 are in the human fleet, the fifth is...?  In my initial post of this thread, where I list my 5 big questions that we're left with from this episode, I bring up the viable option that the fifth was on the Cylon basestar (as a hostage), but who is to know for a certainty?  What's interesting to me is how Dianna knows who's who by name.  I guess her visions "told" her more than what she simply saw.  She knows, by name, who the 5 are.

I'm quite certain that the planet that they're on is Earth, and the only reason why I postulated otherwise is due to the Pythian Prophecy.  It is very clear: Rosalin does not get to go to the new land.  So there's very little room for interpreting the results of the facts: Earth must not be the new land, or if Earth is the new land, then they're not on Earth.

In regards to the mysterious Colonial signal SPOILER: If what's been stated before is true, that Kara's corpse is going to be found inside of her old viper, then it would make "sense" (in a semi-metaphysical way) that her new viper would be the only craft in the fleet to receive the signal, especially if Kara and her ship were "resurrected."  If the human species has had successful unions with Cylons in past cycles, then it's entirely feasible that the human species really isn't human, but is actually "Cylon," and is thus resurrectable.  Kara died when she found Earth.  She was resurrected, along with her ship, and was sent back to be found.  SPOILER

My two cents anyway.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 15, 2008, 07:51:28 PM
Her visions might've only just given her images. All of the four so far were on New Caprica. Presumably the Cylons would've had records on all of them.

D'anna is not a reliable source. Ergo, there may be a fifth in the fleet, but D'anna has her own reasons for keeping it quiet. She did say that she thought the only way to keep alive was through her knowledge of the Five.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 15, 2008, 08:17:29 PM
Quote from: Kyle_K_ski;103281


I'm quite certain that the planet that they're on is Earth, and the only reason why I postulated otherwise is due to the Pythian Prophecy.  It is very clear: Rosalin does not get to go to the new land.  So there's very little room for interpreting the results of the facts: Earth must not be the new land, or if Earth is the new land, then they're not on Earth.



Maybe they found Terra, not Earth ( maybe a TOS style story plot? ).
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 15, 2008, 08:23:12 PM
Hmm.. what about to capture a non-lobotomized Cylon Raider, to cut its pair of wings, to put it on wheels and then to go retine-scan around?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 15, 2008, 09:23:13 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;103279

Rauko: 3 does say "There are four in your fleet", which i take to means, There are 4 in the human fleet, but it could be RDM trying to make us dig deeper i guess


Perhaps her whole thought is "There are four in your fleet that I want." Do you at least see the difference?
When Roslin starts thinking along the lines of "only 4 in the fleet and the 5th isn't" the 3 corrects Roslin and finishes her thought that there are 4 that she wants.

This is the D'Anna we're talking about and she's very manipulative and good at using words to misdirect and confuse.
Even if she really did mean theres only 4 in the fleet, do we really believe her word on that?
Would it not be in her best interested to make Roslin think that the 5th is not in the fleet? I think yes.

But eh, like I said, not convinced of either one.

Anyway, can't really think of anything else about the episode worth discussing.
I just wanted to bring up this one point before everyone and their 3rd cousin started basing a whole new line-up of possible 5th cylons arguments on the assumption that we understand D'Anna correctly (or believe her at all).

Please continue with whatever other topics you can think of...

By the way, it' Earth. Okay? Okay :yes:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 15, 2008, 10:28:22 PM
You are reading WAY too much into that.  D'Anna isn't correcting Laura, she is cutting her off as a power play technique in negotiation.  The old--I'm running the show here routine.

I do agree it's Earth.  With the pic comparison to NYC, I tend to think it is supposed to strongly suggest NYC to us, but to look different enough that we don't feel it is contemporary NYC.  This could be a NYC from our several hundred year future destroyed and abandoned for several thousand years after that, or even farther down the timeline yet.

I do feel the gnashing of teeth over the "pylon wreckage" in the water is a red herring.  That is just as likely just plain old wreckage from the bridge deck sticking up at an odd angle. As for the Brooklyn side of te bridge looking like it's not out in the water as much, there's a big obstruction in the way so we can't really tell. It also isn't unreasonable to have land reclamation moving current shorelines, little details like this are called cultural features and anyone who has spent any time learning military map-study has had it drilled into them that cultural features change at the whims of the culture, so don't be surprised when they change.  Who knows what the junk is even farther out in the channel, somebody built something os a ship sank.  But it doesn't really mater because it CAN'T be New York City of today.  We haven't gone to Kobol yet.  So we shouldn't be too distracted by the fact it looks familiar in the less-likely to change parts but different in the details.

As for the change in the Viper, it may not have changed at all.  The signal may be the change and the Viper was ready to receive it all along.  There is the bit of weirdness that only that Viper's nav system picks it up, but that would also account for the Viper being an attraction to the three.  The signal is the source of the music they heard this time around and they were drawn to it.  The change is merely that the signal is now there when it wasn't before.  And if the three had not been drawn to it the signal would probably have been missed.
Title: The TRUTH about the 5th Cylon
Post by: Mod_Mongerer on June 15, 2008, 11:14:31 PM
All,

I didn't read this entire thread, but I have a pretty good idea of what it's about. :)  I think I've figured out who the fifth Cylon is (IMHO).  Let's think back to season 1 for a moment.  Remember when they found a copy of Leobin (the blonde Cylon dude) on a ship in the fleet, and Starbuck was dispatched to interrogate him, and they started their love/hate relationship?  Towards the end of the episode, right before President Roslin gives the order to blow him out of the airlock (didn't know at the time it would become a huge trend in the series), Leobin tells Roslin that "Adama is a Cylon".  Now, fast forward to "Revelations" where Deanna states that she wants the "four that are in the fleet".  I think that what she meant was that since she knows who the fifth one is, and the fact that she is so sure that person is not in the fleet, that it is one of the hostages (just as previously speculated).  And, based on Leobin's original "confession" of a few years ago...BINGO....it's Admiral William Adama.

Could Leobin have been lying to Roslin?  Perhaps, but I don't think so.  This is just my opinion, and I could be wrong, but I did predict (not on any forum) that when they find Earth that it would most likely be a nuclear wasteland.

Any thoughts?  (I apologize if this idea has already been raised earlier in this thread.)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 15, 2008, 11:56:45 PM
The weakness in that idea is Leoben didn't know or has at least not shown the least clue that he knows who any of the final five are previous to D'Anna bringing Tory back. He does know who all the known Cylons are, so about the only thing we can conclude is he was lying to sow Fear Uncertianty and Doubt.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Star Dragon on June 16, 2008, 12:02:20 AM
I hate to say it, but they way it is would have been the perfect way to end the series...

But now with 10 more episodes, how much more can you milk this cow before messing with continuity?

Fact: It's Earth
Fact: It's a screwed and probably lethal/useless Planet.
Fact: Roslin lives, unless it's Lee now?

Oh and the Vulcan Science institute has stated: Time Travel is Impossible... :)

As for Earth itself:
The Cloverfield monster wasn't stopped by the one nuke. It went beserk all over the globe and Humanity nuked itself in desperation. With nothing to eat the monster eventually died...

There's your "lost stye" tie-in...
 


Speculation:
I would die laughing if they found footage of a 3rd party wacking Earth! Great, if we had gotten here earlier maybe we could have saved them! Or something like that...

There's still too much that feels like outside manupulation...

Oh and the last Cylon is probably SHAW, she didn't die after all and is NOT physically in the fleet. :)

I blew something up Friday, I'm taking a break now with Anarchy Online.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 16, 2008, 12:51:57 AM
Fantastic, if somewhat predictable.

Now we have the rest of the series to find out what happenned to Earth, the truth between the cycle of human/cylon civilization, is there actually some intelligence behind their joint history, whether this human/cylon 'union' will actually work, and whether or not the other (evil) Cylons will throw a monumental spanner in the works.

I can't wait. I'm just frustrated that so far it's been easy enough to figure out the plot from just the first season.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 16, 2008, 12:54:48 AM
Quote from: Deckard;103286
Hmm.. what about to capture a non-lobotomized Cylon Raider, to cut its pair of wings, to put it on wheels and then to go retine-scan around?


Knight Rider? :p
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 16, 2008, 01:07:55 AM
Quote from: karajorma;103268
you might as well claim the show is in the same universe as Firefly


Shit, it's Earth That Was!

Galactica's going to go find Serenity and go kick the shit out of the Alliance. Fuck yeah!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: ratatosk on June 16, 2008, 01:17:32 AM
That could be any city along a river In fact it could also be a megalopolis. But I think its whats left of Annapolis the street layout looks the same as in the book about the temple of  aurora. Give or take 200 years
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 16, 2008, 01:18:34 AM
Quote from: KewlToyZ;103304
Knight Rider? :p


Lol, that would be an option ;)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 16, 2008, 02:11:08 AM
As usual Enki, I'm not sure if you're arguing or agreeing with me on a couple points.
Cut up your post quite a bit to highlight.

Quote from: Enki;103290
You are reading WAY too much into that.  D'Anna isn't correcting Laura, she is cutting her off as a power play technique in negotiation.  The old--I'm running the show here routine.


Yes, I agree, it could very well be that. But I still maintain that both are valid options, not to mention the 3rd option that she's just plain lying.

Quote from: Enki;103290

With the pic comparison to NYC, I tend to think it is supposed to strongly suggest NYC to us, but to look different enough that we don't feel it is contemporary NYC...
...I do feel the gnashing of teeth over the "pylon wreckage" in the water is a red herring...
...So we shouldn't be too distracted by the fact it looks familiar in the less-likely to change parts but different in the details.


Yes, like I said, familiar enough to feel like home but different enough to be just about anything they want it to be.

Quote from: Enki;103290

As for the change in the Viper, it may not have changed at all.  The signal may be the change and the Viper was ready to receive it all along.  There is the bit of weirdness that only that Viper's nav system picks it up, but that would also account for the Viper being an attraction to the three.  The signal is the source of the music they heard this time around and they were drawn to it.  The change is merely that the signal is now there when it wasn't before.  And if the three had not been drawn to it the signal would probably have been missed.


Definitely agree here. As I said earlier, after some thought and from what Lee said about other ships not getting the signal, I think the signal is the only thing that changed. You bring up a good point on how that could have brought the others to it. And, admittedly, this would mean the 5th Cylon doesn't have to be on Galactica to do it.

So that means my long standing faint suspicion that the Hybrid is the 5th could still be true :p though I have no proof and it doesn't really make a lot of sense...eh oh well at least I don't think its Galactica :squeeze:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 16, 2008, 03:36:49 AM
just watched the exchange about the "four in your fleet" again, and the way she said I want the four in your fleet.. really just seems to be her overlooking and ignoring roslins question of where was the fifth, she says there are four in your fleet and then doesnt acknowledge roslins question, so if she would have continued uninterrupted it would have been one train of thought.  much the way Enki said, its her saying I'm in charge
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 16, 2008, 03:49:12 AM
The 5th being Admiral Adama still haunts me with the Razor scenes.
So far nothing explains his hallucination when he touched the vat, not to mention why he would have stuck his hand in it the first place. How did he get that sort of connection to the Cylons?
Tigh has been known to him for 30 years.
Could the final 5 be evolved over generations of Cylons in the cycle?
Could they have been left overs from the first Cylon war or even altered genetically aberated humans through the Cylon Eugenics for the purpose to be where they are now?
Could the old man have flashed that hallucination as his only memory of what they actually did to him after the hand grabbed him? No sense of time elapsed?
When Tigh and Adama first met it wasn't at the best points of their lives.
They decided to go back into the military together on a lark almost.
Was it them just getting oriented and following their subconscious pre programmed objectives?
Pretty intense stuff to ponder until season 5 starts.
And yes I'm calling it season 5, this half season stuff by name is what frak's me off so bad. Why didn't they state it for what it was? This is not a half season.
Marketing puke jargon and misdirection is the only explanation.
Must be those cable guys from the Direct TV ads doing this gerry rigged operation. :devel:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 16, 2008, 05:45:56 AM
You all assume we know who the fifth is.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 16, 2008, 07:12:26 AM
Quote from: Enki;103290
I do agree it's Earth.  With the pic comparison to NYC, I tend to think it is supposed to strongly suggest NYC to us, but to look different enough that we don't feel it is contemporary NYC.  This could be a NYC from our several hundred year future destroyed and abandoned for several thousand years after that, or even farther down the timeline yet.


While I'm also pretty certain it's Earth (it would be pretty cheap otherwise) I don't agree with you on it being NY for certain in any timeline. It could just as easily be generic skyscrapered Earth city 1.

If I was a lazy artist looking to work out a designed for a ruined Earth city I'd also use NY as a template regardless of whether or not it was meant to be that particular city. For that sort of thing you want ruined skyscrapers etc and NY has exactly the right sort of skyline for that. I certainly wouldn't use London as that's even more recognisable.

I think it's reading too much into the effects to say that the city has to be NY. For all we know the concept artist may simply have picked NY cause they always wanted to see it destroyed. :p
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: THE Phreak on June 16, 2008, 08:58:34 AM
Quote from: Rauko;103230
As Cl1nt said, get over it, its Earth.
Besides anyone else think that was supposed to be either mainland NYC or perhaps Oakland looking at San Francisco? The whole bridge to the right could be the Golden Gate. The island seemed too wide to be SF though, and it could be any bridge.

I live in Oakland, its a possibility. Although the Bay bridge is less thick than the bridge shown, plus we'd see some remains of Yerba Buena Island .

http://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/93/100393-004.jpg


Also someone mentioned the Terra thing: I read on that too. It might be it.

http://www.pcimagenetwork.com/fran/bay_bridge_12.jpg

The view from Oakland is about the same, in a clear day you can see the skyscrapers in SF. But the East Bay span is think as heck.

I tend to agree they chose NY as an Iconic landmark or used it as an inspiration make a Generic super city to show that our Civilization had Megacities at the time of its death.

Or they'll pull a Lost and we'll discover people living underground.

EDIT:

I think this is what bombed NY:
(http://l.yimg.com/img.movies.yahoo.com/ymv/us/img/hv/photo/movie_pix/twentieth_century_fox/independence_day/id4newyork.jpg)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Sidestep on June 16, 2008, 11:38:52 AM
Quote from: Enki;103290


As for the change in the Viper, it may not have changed at all.  The signal may be the change and the Viper was ready to receive it all along.  There is the bit of weirdness that only that Viper's nav system picks it up, but that would also account for the Viper being an attraction to the three.  The signal is the source of the music they heard this time around and they were drawn to it.  The change is merely that the signal is now there when it wasn't before.  And if the three had not been drawn to it the signal would probably have been missed.


I think that's a great shout. The Viper was always ready to receive the signal, the signal just wasn't being transmitted yet, and The 4 were triggered by the same signal.

But then it begs the question, why did the signal turn on now, and how did it turn on/who turned it on?

I thought this was a great episode, one of my favourites, really well paced throughout and lived up to its episode name.

It'll be long wait to find out what happened to Earth now though, frakking Sci-fi Channel...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 16, 2008, 11:42:14 AM
As I mentioned when I first brought up that idea, perhaps the signal was always going but the just got close enough for it?
Its a different signal than the sounds they heard in the nebula, so perhaps it wasn't strong enough until now.

Also...I'm guessing 4.5 will start with them actually tracking where that signal is coming from? I hope?....please? Would be awfully silly to ignore that. You tracked it to Earth darnit, now take that viper out for a flight and zone in on its source!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 16, 2008, 12:11:30 PM
Kara's Viper had to come from somewhere, right?

So what if the portal/wormhole that her Viper came through also let the music through - thus, the four were activated, but then the portal closed, the music stopped, and the Viper no longer showed the Earth signal. So when it got checked out, it didn't show anything, but once the fleet got close enough, the Viper began receiving the signal directly.

In a delicious irony, what if the event that brought Kara there also nuked Earth? A strong EMP is a signature effect of a nuclear device. Probably not the direction the show is going to go, but it would be interesting nonetheless...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Seeker on June 16, 2008, 12:30:52 PM
Quote from: Vektram;103231
My current ideas:

1. Roslin is not the dying leader. Starbuck is, this would fit with her "special destiny" and her paintings of the eye, which to me are far more indicative of a prophet than drug induced visions.


This is a great point!  It dovetails with possibilities of Starbuck actually being Starbuck v2.  I have been thinking to myself about simplicity....really: Kara's ship blew up in contest with galactic forces...then she shows up again with weird memories of (what turns out to be) the ressurection hub and a spiffy new Viper.  Starbuck v1 is dead (or at that time of prophecy going to die or 'dying') and Starbuck v2 is the Final One.  

What if:  The Earth is a result of the lost Tribe that also did the whole Cylon thing on Earth.  At the end of thier little apocalypse, the surviving Cylon/Human earthers (herafter referred to as CHE) decided to send a call out to their 'lost Tribes' (the twelve colonies - and why are they called 'colonies' again?).  Starbuck v2 is the final One - a CHE.


Or not....what the frak...let's just have fun watching the thing unfold and guessing!!!!


Rally to Spork!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 16, 2008, 03:11:43 PM
I think the one thing we've decided for sure is we can't/shouldn't try to figure out which modern Earth city they are at. have to remember they are in the BSG universe so things could be radically different and maybe in their universe the only buildings ever built in New york were replicas of the empire state building. Bashing our heads into the wall would probably be about as productive as postulating which city it is.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 16, 2008, 04:34:59 PM
Quote from: karajorma;103322
While I'm also pretty certain it's Earth (it would be pretty cheap otherwise) I don't agree with you on it being NY for certain in any timeline. It could just as easily be generic skyscrapered Earth city 1.

If I was a lazy artist looking to work out a designed for a ruined Earth city I'd also use NY as a template regardless of whether or not it was meant to be that particular city. For that sort of thing you want ruined skyscrapers etc and NY has exactly the right sort of skyline for that. I certainly wouldn't use London as that's even more recognisable.

I think it's reading too much into the effects to say that the city has to be NY. For all we know the concept artist may simply have picked NY cause they always wanted to see it destroyed. :p


I'm not saying it is NYC, I'm saying it's supposed to vaguely remind us of NYC.  The vague reminder angle has more unconscious emotional impact than an abstract city.  And I agree with you that that also makes the cgi job easier.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 16, 2008, 05:01:25 PM
Ah. In that case I agree with you.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: combat on June 16, 2008, 08:04:26 PM
maybe its just the one city that got nuked
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 16, 2008, 08:24:02 PM
I'm sure they wouldnt have been flying in to land and say hey, forget all those clearly populated cities, lets go to the destroyed one and look forlorn while we poke around in the dirt.

though along those lines, if the whole planet isnt like that there may be some holdout cities of survivors living pseudo Mad-Max style, in the aftermath
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 16, 2008, 10:25:20 PM
Out of interest, am I the only one who watching the approach thought "Way to look like an invasion force guys!" :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 16, 2008, 11:32:32 PM
Tyrol is one of my favourite characters and the performance of Aaron douglas as actor is purely awesome. Once said all that.. am I the only dude/dudette noticing how Tyrol is smiling during the final Earth travelling shots?. He's undoubtfully smirking and shaking his head.. What the f*** was that?. :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 17, 2008, 01:01:20 AM
Quote from: karajorma;103378
Out of interest, am I the only one who watching the approach thought "Way to look like an invasion force guys!" :D


LOL! When I saw them enmasse at the outer orbit all I could think is, all hell is breaking loose right now with the population downstairs.
Where are the satellites? Who is looking up right now screaming about the apocalypse! Wait, is that a missile coming up already?
Actually everything went so numb and sedated I was sort of dissappointed it was so uneventful to come into a dead planet. Even though the atmo didn't look burnt or wasted.:eek2:
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 17, 2008, 01:32:23 AM
Well what we didn't see was the first reaction in CIC.  Gaeta would be saying something like "No DRADIS contacts;  No electronic signatures.  WTF???"  

Followed by an hour and a half of the same thing as the RTF+ did one lap before deciding to land where they did.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 17, 2008, 02:04:45 AM
Quote from: Deckard;103383
Tyrol is one of my favourite characters and the performance of Aaron douglas as actor is purely awesome. Once said all that.. am I the only dude/dudette noticing how Tyrol is smiling during the final Earth travelling shots?. He's undoubtfully smirking and shaking his head.. What the f*** was that?. :D


Tyrol's life is now such a shitheap that he actively enjoys all the crap that gets flung at him.

I remember reading that Aaron Douglas talked to RDM about the season 3 finale, as he was annoyed that they turned the character into a Cylon. Apparently RDM managed to get him to agree that he wasn't going to ruin the character.

It seems that this spiral of destruction raining down on Tyrol and turning him into a bit of a loony is what that was all about. There aren't many TV shows or movies that would have the balls to do that.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 17, 2008, 03:30:37 AM
Quote from: Crixx;103391
Tyrol's life is now such a shitheap that he actively enjoys all the crap that gets flung at him.

I remember reading that Aaron Douglas talked to RDM about the season 3 finale, as he was annoyed that they turned the character into a Cylon. Apparently RDM managed to get him to agree that he wasn't going to ruin the character.

It seems that this spiral of destruction raining down on Tyrol and turning him into a bit of a loony is what that was all about. There aren't many TV shows or movies that would have the balls to do that.


well yeah look at all thats happened, he's lost deck crew, friends, his wife, essentially his humanity, he just keeps getting one bad hand after another, so when they came to arrest him he laughed, and when they were down on the ground he laughed because once again they are screwed and his life sucks.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 17, 2008, 06:59:12 AM
Not to mention having his wife threatened by his CO after striking for poor labor conditions, after living on Cylon-occupied New Caprica, after striking on New Caprica for poor working conditions, after being thrown in the brig and almost getting executed for preventing rape, after finding out that his ex-girlfriend is a Cylon, after she tried to kill herself, after getting marooned after crash-landing on Kobol, after most of Galactica's pilots die in an accident on his hangar deck, after breaking up with his girlfriend, after being investigated for being a traitor, after having his deck crew devastated by fires and humanity getting decimated by mass nuclear strikes.

Yeah Tyrol's had a pretty bad last couple of years compared to most people.

Man, that blow to the back of Baltar's head must have been really satisfying.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: karajorma on June 17, 2008, 09:35:37 AM
Quote from: Enki;103390
Well what we didn't see was the first reaction in CIC.  Gaeta would be saying something like "No DRADIS contacts;  No electronic signatures.  WTF???"  

Followed by an hour and a half of the same thing as the RTF+ did one lap before deciding to land where they did.


Yeah, I figured that. While I'm sure that all that happened, we never saw it. :)

However even during the celebrations on arrival I was thinking "Hang on a sec, if Earth has any sophisticated defence systems they've just seen a possibly heavily armed fleet appear out of nowhere!" :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: zachary on June 17, 2008, 12:38:01 PM
Quote from: Josh_88;103366
though along those lines, if the whole planet isnt like that there may be some holdout cities of survivors living pseudo Mad-Max style, in the aftermath

Personally, I'm just waiting for the Vault-Dweller to show up and ask "Do you guys have a Water Chip?"
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 17, 2008, 06:25:17 PM
On the Tyrol thing: Yep, all this has sense. For a second what did come to my mind was someone behind the cameras doing the idiot and saying to Aaron somrething like: "Hey dude, big money and vacation time in half an hour..." :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 17, 2008, 09:21:03 PM
Quote from: zachary;103414
Personally, I'm just waiting for the Vault-Dweller to show up and ask "Do you guys have a Water Chip?"


Then he'll have less time to do the next bit :(
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Seeker on June 18, 2008, 12:08:24 AM
Quote from: Josh_88;103394
so when they came to arrest him he laughed, and when they were down on the ground he laughed because once again they are screwed and his life sucks.


I didn't really notice that...but he just became one of my all-time fav characters.  Titus (the comedian) said something along the lines that those who have lived totally screwed up lives are more trust-worthy because when the stuff hits the fan, they ... step to the side.  Then they look at the other poor stuff-covered grunts all complaining and say: "Yep...that sucks, huh?  Lemme help you up....Oh, you still got a little right there on your forehead..."
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Seeker on June 18, 2008, 12:14:56 AM
...and I can't wait for him to find out about Cali's cause of death....They could spend a whole episode on Chief beating the snot out of Tori....
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 18, 2008, 12:28:32 AM
On the entrance thing, the soundtrack immediately came to my mind was "Apocalypse Now". For a second I was expecting a wing of advanced USA fighters proceding with some interception protocol.

By the way... what could be the feelings of the ISS dudes looking at the Colonial Fleet arriving and jumping in orbit?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 18, 2008, 12:38:14 AM
Quote from: Seeker;103473
...and I can't wait for him to find out about Cali's cause of death....They could spend a whole episode on Chief beating the snot out of Tori....


to be honest, tori has become one of the more annoying characters since becomeing a cylon

I really do hope theres an episode with the Cheif, Roslin and many others beating her, shes desrving it...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 18, 2008, 01:21:02 AM
I too would be ok with this idea wolfy
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 18, 2008, 07:32:52 AM
We should start a petition.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 18, 2008, 08:38:11 AM
Quote from: Deckard;103475
By the way... what could be the feelings of the ISS dudes looking at the Colonial Fleet arriving and jumping in orbit?


"Oh, thank God. Now I don't have to come up with a story to explain how we broke the toilet again."
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Sidestep on June 18, 2008, 09:43:28 AM
Quote from: Wolfy;103476
to be honest, tori has become one of the more annoying characters since becomeing a cylon

I really do hope theres an episode with the Cheif, Roslin and many others beating her, shes desrving it...


Especially when she told Roslin she was done taking orders from her, when Rosylin was only asking her to co-operate.

I bet there are plenty of big sticks on Earth they could use...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Dash-Rendar on June 18, 2008, 11:18:53 AM
Hello everyone, it's my first message here and I would like to salute all the community and particularily the devs for this magnificent Freespace 2 TC...

Now 'bout the frakking issue :
Let's say it's earth. The colonials came all the way and now found an atomised (does that word exists in english ?) planet. Atomised some years back as the geiger counter (to check radiation count ?) doesn't get mad.

Oh and yeah, nobody wears any NBC suits so I guess the radiation have faded, and in case of a nuclear holocaust, radiation would take time before fading wouldn't it ? (Seems to me that the cylons only nuked major cities on the colonies as there were survivors)

But now, thinking about is, what if the 5th cylon (as an entire "type", so enough to have a little army) had nuked earth ? This way we may have some brand new characters and that would explain Dana's  "the 4 that are in your fleet".
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 18, 2008, 11:30:43 AM
Firstly, allow me to welcome you to the forum! so yeh, welcome.

Secondly: Does anyone still have the welcome animation with the Galacticas Flak?

Quote from: Dash-Rendar;103504
Hello everyone, it's my first message here and I would like to salute all the community and particularily the devs for this magnificent Freespace 2 TC...

Now 'bout the frakking issue :
Let's say it's earth. The colonials came all the way and now found an atomised (does that word exists in english ?) planet. Atomised some years back as the geiger counter (to check radiation count ?) doesn't get mad.

Oh and yeah, nobody wears any NBC suits so I guess the radiation have faded, and in case of a nuclear holocaust, radiation would take time before fading wouldn't it ? (Seems to me that the cylons only nuked major cities on the colonies as there were survivors)

But now, thinking about is, what if the 5th cylon (as an entire "type", so enough to have a little army) had nuked earth ? This way we may have some brand new characters and that would explain Dana's  "the 4 that are in your fleet".


you mean they find the final cylon on Earth?

Perosnally, i wouldnt be suprised if they dont find a small band of survivors on Earth or/and they find a bunch of Earth Cylons or somthing like that. Even after a hucelear holocost, there could be thousands, if not a few mllion survivors around the world, i imagine that would drop quite quickly due to radiation, lack of food, etc.

I imagine if survivor groups got to a hostpital and found the Radiation Meds, theyd have a chance to survive. AND theyd have Asprin! :D ...sorry...

Renember, in World War Two, there where people directly below where the nukes over japan exploded, and they survived, though i bet there life expectancy was drasitcally decreased.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 18, 2008, 12:08:37 PM
Earth hasn't been recently nuked. Look at all the trees growing out of solid masonry. That's taken some time, at least a few generations. I'd imagine any radiation would by now be quite tolerable.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 18, 2008, 02:01:10 PM
here you go Wolfy, I knew I still had it somewhere :-)

(http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f179/swimrjosh/BSG/Welcome-Salvo.gif)

edit.... oops guess this is the version that doesnt say welcome... crap haha leaving it because it looks cool anyway
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Dash-Rendar on June 18, 2008, 03:20:58 PM
@Josh_88 (As we say here, "C'est l'intention qui compte", the spirit is what counts most)

Quote from: Calantyr;103512
Earth hasn't been recently nuked. Look at all the trees growing out of solid masonry. That's taken some time, at least a few generations. I'd imagine any radiation would by now be quite tolerable.

Well it doesn't take that long for a tree to grow... Its roots. As for the destroyed look of the buildings, well I guess a nuke is an issue for having a tidy town.

Then, let's remember Tchernobyl. A massive radiation cloud went from Ukrainia to western Europe. (Including France, even if officials won't admit it) So I suppose that a major nuclear holocaust (now referred as NH, for the guys from Boston, no harm meant) may have provoked the death of at least 40% to 60% of the livings on hits, and the rest may have been reduced to 1% byt the radiation and the nuclear winter. So bye bye survivors. But the geiger doesn't bip that much so, ok time may have passed since. Don't forget this is Science Fiction, so a little time-ellipse and Voilà, you have your NH by the 5th. And the writtings take place some times back so, the 5th may be the 1rst...As said in the Bible : "The last shall be the first" !

Yet, their is a possibility : the swiss may still be alive, as they have enough shelters to save all of their folks, the NH may not have bothered them. !
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 18, 2008, 04:17:57 PM
Quote from: Calantyr;103512
Earth hasn't been recently nuked. Look at all the trees growing out of solid masonry. That's taken some time, at least a few generations. I'd imagine any radiation would by now be quite tolerable.


Radiation is insidious.  What you can safely tolerate for a few minutes outside your skin will surely kill you as a growing child before you reach sexual maturity.  Or if you don't die, screw up your reproductive organs so much you have profoundly deformed offspring or are sterile altogether.   The problem is survivors have to eat, and food stockpiles only last a couple years at best.  Once you start feeding folks radiologically hot food the final timer is set, a generation or two and it's all over.

Animals returned to Chernobyl from the outside after the short half-life, low energy, stuff decayed away. There wasn't much high energy ionizing products leaked - and it will still be unsafe for human permament habitation for a couple hundred years.  A nuc blast will make not short half life products, but nasty long half life high energy ionizing radioactive everything.  Everywhere.  For a couple ten thousands of years.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Dash-Rendar on June 18, 2008, 05:28:10 PM
@bout the hunger problem... Well doesn't radiation works like an ever-working microwave ?:blah: [I know, i'm of no use and the community was better off without me =p]
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 18, 2008, 07:06:39 PM
Not really.  A microwave is way to sedate an energy to create mutations and damage that will affect cellular division.  It uses brute force like a blowtorch to make the entire object heat up.

High energy radiation mostly sneaks through sloppy void-filled cellular walls made mostly of water and with laser-scalpel like precision knocks an atom or molecule out of whack here or there in the DNA of the nucleus.  Do that enough and you are bound to hit something critical to cellular reproduction.  Ergo cancer.  Eat something radioactive and all your low radiation protective programmed to die outer layers of skin don't help.  radiation makes a mess of that ill protected intestinal tract, then particles hitch a ride in the bloodstream to other unprotected interior sites to try to do more damage there too.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Tikey on June 18, 2008, 07:40:47 PM
(http://wearscience.com/img190/cheers.gif)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 18, 2008, 07:59:54 PM
Well actually, I don't know if you folks saw the documentary or not on the Discovery & History Channels, but Earth after Humanity was very interesting to say the least. Survival by many species was possible without us and the planet would do some pretty substantial things within just a few years to clean itself up. What was really interesting is what happens to all nuclear power plants within a few weeks when power is gone, they all go nuclear as well, but nature seems to be able to bounce back and adjust for it over time. Of course like the areas around Chernobyl, they are just not where you want to go for quite some time. Quite a good show to watch if you get the time:
http://library.digiguide.com/lib/programme/Life+After+People-637025/Documentary/
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 18, 2008, 08:10:07 PM
wow, for once we dont have a physics debate, but a bioligy debate!!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 18, 2008, 08:48:17 PM
Even kewler (I know it aint a word and I aint supposed to say it) was the light show from all the unattended satellite trash making a return to the atmo. Even more curious is Japan's ortbiting solar power generator beaming power to its own substation in a microwave laser so to speak for supposedly powering cites slated to make its debut in 2010 with an entire network by 2013. Which sounds like a really mundane use of an extraordinarily powerful orbiting weapons platform. I could be wrong though and just luny like the proponents of HAARP (40 acre antennae array) at the pole used to beam low frequency radio waves able to use the ionosphere as a giant antenna for broadcasting to submarines at extreme depths for communications.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Kyle_K_ski on June 18, 2008, 11:10:37 PM
I have no idea of determining how long after the nukes have fallen the final scene was set on Earth.  The fact that we can see so much physical structure, such as the remains of the buildings and bridge, the small amount of "re-greening" and the low readings from the geiger counter all point to contradictory information.

It's my understanding that pretty much the only man made materials that'll persist after humans are gone (however they're removed, almost assuredly from our own arrogance & stupidity) are plastic and bronze.  Especially bronze.  It's extremely resilient to corrosion, pollution and oxidization.  

With the low radiation readings, I'd surmise that thousands of years must have passed, but the presence of the buildings, and the low amounts of regreening leads me to assume that it hasn't been too long after the calamity has occurred.  With that small amount of background radiation, the buildings should be entirely gone (at most covered up as mounds of organic growth), and the vegetation restored.  

Maybe with enough searching they'd come across part of a bronze statue of somebody once revered for their wisdom, and an empty snack food bag and beverage bottle.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Aquaron on June 18, 2008, 11:46:00 PM
Nature will always find a way to recover and life will always prosper in the most savage of enviroments.There are sealife thriving next to underwater volcanoes today.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Seeker on June 19, 2008, 12:46:55 AM
Life will always find a way...for there is Spork.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Ender on June 19, 2008, 12:53:34 AM
i watched that life after people thing on channel 4 about a month ago, to be honest i found it a bit exagerated, like 5 years after man was gone i think there was lions and rhinos going about NYC, but when it said one year ago there was nothing like that, so when you think about it, zoos dont store 5 years worth of food, and even if they did the animals would still have to escape to get to it, so it made me think how did they get their, maybe it was a goof, maybe forgot to mention them in the one year later bt, but their was other stuff, like showing a car completely decay and rust out in 5 years, theirs a car down the road from where i live that my neghbour uses as a donor car, he doesnt service it or anyitnhg, he just takes the odd thing out of it that he needs, yet its fine and it's been sitting for a good 5 or 6 years now, another example is i think someone found a car out in the desert or sometinhg and the only realy damage was that all the paint had been taken away by the sand and i think it'd been there for even longer,

and the animals with cats making drastic evolutions to fly/glide in just a thousand years, i could be wrong but i thought it was a lot longer for evolutionary changes to happen,

i just think that things in human creations would last a lot longer, obviously that would happen, and in that order, just a bit slower, and with the exception of wild lions and rhinos, and possibly the evolution,

i think the first 10 years were just given a huge acceleration for ratings,

anyway back on track, theirs gotta be some survivors there, or at least bodys or skelatel remains,
and if not some sorta message or clue saying this is what happened, anyway, i'm off, i'm in france and have to ration my internets spareling since they cut off like mad here
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 19, 2008, 12:56:12 AM
spork has now acheived ledgendary status

So anyway, anyone any ideas where the crew of the Galactica could go next?

personally i presume there going to go back to kobol or the colonies, or find a nice new, planet. seeming theres 10 episodes left, i doubt they plan to stay on this Earth place for the rest of the season
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 19, 2008, 02:03:48 AM
its far away from the Cylons who may still be in the colonies so they may just wait it out to build up again before going back. Plus lets face it, if I had a chance to leave a 3 year cruise of war and hell to take up restarting humanity on an empty world, I would take it rather than put up with the black market nonsense, cramped spaces, rationing in space with no choice but to take it and whatever sh1t job they assigned me....
Sorryyyyyy I'd bail from the fleet with a group feeling the same way as long as it wasn't some Koresh kind of freak show luny's.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 19, 2008, 02:20:42 AM
Dude you know what ever nuclear war happened that New Zealand got ignored :P c'mon you know it. Might even be isolated by ocean enough to not get hurt much by fallout. Everyone usually says Alaska cause theres nothing there, but its a US state so someone would probably still nuke it just out of spite.

New Zealand ftw.  (I'm a Yank by the way with absolutely no logical reason to love NZ)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 19, 2008, 02:27:12 AM
Oh don't worry, I'm sure us aussies would find a way to take NZ out.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 19, 2008, 02:34:22 AM
They are bound to find a twinkie.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Aquaron on June 19, 2008, 03:17:05 AM
Quote
Oh don't worry, I'm sure us aussies would find a way to take NZ out.
Hell most of them are down at Bondi these days.Actually the NZ defense force hasen,t even got an air force these days.The ex Aussie A4 Skyhawks have not long been retired IIRC.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 19, 2008, 03:58:30 AM
Flugtag... the NZ Airforce open tryouts?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dqG0hA3dPI
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 19, 2008, 11:34:55 AM
Lol Thanks Kewl for that. Almost cried when the Eagle replica went in the water, but moments later I almost cried laughing at the camera man when he zoomed back to...check something out xD

Anyway, yea I suppose those Aussies might, but I was under the impression that the AU military wasn't exactly huge either (well at least it exists) and they'd be too busy getting nuked themselves to worry about NZ. Thus the "forgotten" part :P

But really, think any of the small, remote Pacific islands would be able to avoid the worst of the fallout? Or some other little place I'm not thinking of?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 19, 2008, 11:40:57 AM
We have a population of 20 million in the space of a country the size of America/Europe. We aren't worth nuking.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: YIIMM on June 19, 2008, 12:25:29 PM
Quote from: Cl1nt;103583
We have a population of 20 million in the space of a country the size of America/Europe. We aren't worth nuking.

But you'll be dead soon... (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/end)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 19, 2008, 12:32:44 PM
Quote from: YIIMM;103587
But you'll be dead soon... (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/end)

LOL, i never thought the death of 6 Billion people could be so funny...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 19, 2008, 12:35:13 PM
Except, we live longer than the rest of you.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 19, 2008, 12:47:43 PM
the UK will be fine.

we can build a nice big nuclear sheild out of all our annoying politicians.

seriously, theres that many of them
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 19, 2008, 01:19:31 PM
Ireland, will be fine, impossible to hit us. Too small.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 19, 2008, 01:38:23 PM
And too drunk to fire anything in return.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 19, 2008, 05:13:26 PM
Well there is no point hitting Australia, its already a desolate wasteland full of thieves, that be wasting a good nuke.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Aquaron on June 19, 2008, 10:44:32 PM
Quote
Well there is no point hitting Australia, its already a desolate wasteland full of thieves
Hey that,s not true,we are a lovely bunch of peo.............."******************************
[Signal regained].....______________Rebooting backup****00010111001010
[message from Clint]...your internet has been stolen........Have a nice day....
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 20, 2008, 12:17:48 AM
Quote from: Wolfy;103563
spork has now acheived ledgendary status

So anyway, anyone any ideas where the crew of the Galactica could go next?

personally i presume there going to go back to kobol or the colonies, or find a nice new, planet. seeming theres 10 episodes left, i doubt they plan to stay on this Earth place for the rest of the season


Why not stay on Earth? Afterall the entire point of the series wasx to get to Earth. It would be a bit dumb if they just turn around and bugger off somewhere else.

More likely they'll stay on Earth and try to find some way of breaking the neverending human/Cylon cycle of destruction.

Plenty of stuff for them to do on Earth. Plenty.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 20, 2008, 12:47:23 AM
Quote from: Calantyr;103617
Why not stay on Earth? Afterall the entire point of the series wasx to get to Earth. It would be a bit dumb if they just turn around and bugger off somewhere else.

More likely they'll stay on Earth and try to find some way of breaking the neverending human/Cylon cycle of destruction.

Plenty of stuff for them to do on Earth. Plenty.


Because they can't if they don't all want to die of cancer and/or radiation poisoning in the next five years or so.

There wasn't hardly anything growing there, so the radiation was really bad at one point and the soil is still mostly sterile.  That's a bad sign for everywhere else since it is unlikely they landed in the worst spot on the planet on purpose. If there had been other signs of active habitation elsewhere on the planet I don't think they would have all looked so uniformly screwed.

Count your beans, they will pick up on a trail of the departed 13th Tribe, who had a similar, only even hotter radiological, reception after they left Kobol.  It's one of the very few ways the fifth mini-season can make any sense at all.  Then they will end up in the New Land of the scrolls.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 20, 2008, 12:53:37 AM
Well yeah we could just send a frakload of tourism fliers to the Colonials...
http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/bloody-hell-sensitive-poms-rein-in-our-ads/2006/03/09/1141701635149.html)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 20, 2008, 11:53:16 AM
Quote from: Enki;103618
Because they can't if they don't all want to die of cancer and/or radiation poisoning in the next five years or so.

There wasn't hardly anything growing there, so the radiation was really bad at one point and the soil is still mostly sterile.  That's a bad sign for everywhere else since it is unlikely they landed in the worst spot on the planet on purpose. If there had been other signs of active habitation elsewhere on the planet I don't think they would have all looked so uniformly screwed.

Count your beans, they will pick up on a trail of the departed 13th Tribe, who had a similar, only even hotter radiological, reception after they left Kobol.  It's one of the very few ways the fifth mini-season can make any sense at all.  Then they will end up in the New Land of the scrolls.


Doubtful. Very doubtful. Not only would it be a huge departure from the original it completely belittles all the trials and struggles the characters in the story have gone through. The quest for Earth has been the ONLY constant.

There's not enough time left in the series to cover *another* exodus unless it's going to be so short/crap it will destroy the shows ratings utterly.

Also I'm doubtful the radiation is as bad as people make out. There's nothing hinted at which makes it seem intolerable to sustain life at the moment. Uncomfortable, sure, but it's established that the Colonials have some pretty awesome anti-radiation technologies and if I'm right about how long ago the nukes fell it would have had time for the worst to dissapate by now anyway. But on that note there's little evidence either way.


Lastly I don't get what the huge problem people have with understanding the 'Promised Land' that the Scrolls talk about. Prophecy is never obvious, and they never meant the 'Promised Land' was a geographical place. Too simple.

It's a concept. The 'Promised land' is a 'place' where humans/Cylons finally have control over their own destiny. Lee has already taken the first steps with his amnesty to Tigh, Tyrol, etc and offering the alliance to the renegade Cylons. They will have finally found the Promised Land once they break the cycle of constantly blowing themselves up and having to migrate across half the galaxy. Earth may be the key to that (it's been hinted at throughout the series) but it's a means to an end.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 20, 2008, 12:47:41 PM
Holy shit, Aquaron is a local!

SEQ Represent, yo!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 20, 2008, 01:51:02 PM
Enki's point about the radiation is that yeah at the immediate look it seems ok, but the levels are still high enough (looking around and finding little vegetation is one sign) that if they spend any long amount of time there they will start getting birth defects, cancers, things like that due to the radiation exposure. So its not that they will die tomorrow but if they decide to settle and make a new life, a few years down the line that would become a regrettable choice.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 20, 2008, 02:15:32 PM
remember they got those magic radiation medkits though :)

Anyways, the conditions they found do not look promising at all. The sky looks as scorched, not that intensely as seen in the Matrix movie, but pretty screwed. That Geiger detector gets a bunch of particles so looks like radioactive rain may be present. Moderately intense winds... The whole thing looks as the decay of a Nuclear Winter.. maybe 7 decades after Nuclear World Conflict.

Not a bad idea the writters remember us of it once more. We've zillionplicated our  nuclear devastation power on this planet. And most of the people seems to be not very aware of this. The danger is real and exists here and sometimes I think is a miracle it has not happened already. Shit happens
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 20, 2008, 02:35:00 PM
yes, they have these 'magic med kits', however, do you think they have enough for the entire fleet to survive on earth, and remake the human race there. thats over 30,000 med kits per day maybe?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Seeker on June 20, 2008, 04:12:03 PM
They will stay on Earth...only to form the Superscouts under the direct command of the mysterious Dr. Zee...Chief will invent a flying motorcycle...and us it to repeatedly run over Tori.  The final Cylon will be revealed to be 'Cy'.

(OK...I'm off to my much deserved room in hell, now!)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Fairchild on June 20, 2008, 06:08:48 PM
a few inacuracies about nuke plants and radiation.
First off, no reactor plant goes nuclear/detonates like a nuke bomb. Doesn't matter what you do, it cannot happen.
If you site chernobol, it was an explosion due to high temps, not a nuclear explosion.
Every plant would shut down after people left for a long enough time due to a lot of different reasons.
Some due to poison build up due to running, some due to lack of make up water.
At worst you will have a 3 mile island type incident where it melts down and might burn through the containment vessle.

There are 4 types of radiation.
Alpha particals. These can be blocked by the dead skin layer. However they are devistating if they are inhaled or ingested. They do the most damage if they hit unprotected tissue.

Beta- Little more energetic. Can make it through dead layer of skin, but cloths will prevent any damage due to these. Again bad to ingest or inhale.

Gamma- these are high energy particals. If they are high enough, mostly going to pass through with no interaction. However these are the ones that screw with your dna.
Enough of these can kill. 5 REM is the legal limit in the US. 500 and you start to get sick.
Requires 2 inches of lead, 24 inches of water to shield.

Neutron radiation- also high energy. Problem with is is it interacts with the water in your body causing damage that way.It transfers heat and then if absorbed in other materials can cause that material to be come radioactive.
12 inches of water required for shielding 4 inches of lead.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Enki on June 20, 2008, 07:22:51 PM
Quote from: Calantyr;103636
Doubtful. Very doubtful. Not only would it be a huge departure from the original it completely belittles all the trials and struggles the characters in the story have gone through. The quest for Earth has been the ONLY constant.

There's not enough time left in the series to cover *another* exodus unless it's going to be so short/crap it will destroy the shows ratings utterly.

Earth is nearly dead and has already been found.  There is no more tie to TOS, from here out it is RDM on as clean a slate as he wants it to be.  

Far be it for you to predetermine whether he can come up with a reasonable storyline that departs Earth. Personally I think it would be harder to figure out how to stay there without tossing out most of what he showed in the episode close.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 20, 2008, 07:45:50 PM
If they where to stay on Earth, all they have left to do is make peace with the last 3 cylon models, and i dont see a peace talk lasting 10 episodes...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 20, 2008, 10:13:15 PM
1) The radiation counter wasn't going too crazy. If it is sensitive enough you could get almost that much clicking off of natural particles.
Along those lines, if it was really too bad do you think Adama would be playing with the dirt?

2) If they were at the city with the building Lee was talking about then it was probably a pretty important place, which means it would clearly be a larger target for nukes, thus its going to generally look worse there.
More isolated areas could be fine by this time (no doesn't have to be AU, or NZ or Alaska, it could just be any place like Montana, New Mexico or Brazil).

3) Forgot the third point, but good arguments are always supposed to have 3, right?
Oh I remember.

That being said, I wouldn't doubt they go after the 13th colony...BUT that is a big assumption that the 13th Tribe still exists. :/
If it wasn't for another 10 episodes I would suggest they are gone, but I think that many episodes suggest we've got more than just re-settling Earth going on.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 21, 2008, 03:05:13 AM
I think we all can agree it's a city so yes the first logical place to stop for the Colonials.
Being a city it was also ground zero for any Military strike so it didnt have much vegetation to begin with and also suffered the worst effects. So yeah the societies rebuilding may likely have evolved without technology, could just be farmers.
Who knows the speculation is fun though :P
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 21, 2008, 02:02:26 PM
Quote from: Wolfy;103660
If they where to stay on Earth, all they have left to do is make peace with the last 3 cylon models, and i dont see a peace talk lasting 10 episodes...


Yeah, that's all they have left to do...

Except learning the truth of humanities/cylons roots...
Except discovering the final Fith...
Except finding out how various characters have been manipulated throughout the course of the series (visions, etc)...
Except discovering how Starbuck came back from the dead...
Except learning the truth of the Opera house...
Except finding out the significance of the human/Cylon children...
Except finding out what destroyed Earth...
Except trying to survive on their new homeworld...
Except breaking the cycle of destruction that causes humanity to endlessly migrate across the galaxy...
Except defeating the final Cylons if they don't agree to peace...


I'm worried that they won't have ENOUGH time left in the series. Each of these points (and there are more besides) could take up an episode by themselves, and that's not including possible plot twists that throw up new issues.

And then people say they're going to go on a NEW exodus and find another homeworld? In only ten episodes? Even with all the rest of the content they need to fit in?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: wiley on June 21, 2008, 02:56:54 PM
Perhaps they will all die except Hera and Nicky (Adam and Eve) and a few Earth survivors.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Rauko on June 21, 2008, 05:01:03 PM
Not picking on Calantyr in specific, just saying this to start so theres no confusion.

Quote from: Calantyr;103704

Except breaking the cycle of destruction that causes humanity to endlessly migrate across the galaxy...


I keep hearing this same sentiment, that somehow they are breaking out of the cycle...
But I have no clue what you are talking about. I think this IS the cycle. Remember the guy in Razor told her that Starbuck was the harbinger of doom and not to follow her! Maybe HE was telling them how to break out of it.

They aren't breaking out of anything, they are still following it. This is the cycle.
I understand its up to opinion at this point, but I just wanted to bring it up since it seems to be becoming widely accepted.

Lee does say something about ending the cycle at the end of Revelations, but seriously, do you think he really knows what the cycle is? Don't you think every leader at this point in the cycle thought they were ending the cycle?

Every peace treaty is thought of as a final peace by those who sign it (sincerely at least), but they are rarely right. Right for a time maybe, but when we zoom out and look at the whole history, its just another step in the cycle.
They are reaching the end of the cycle now, then a time of cylon/human peace and I'm guessing merger until they are just people and their past differences are forgotten. But then comes the exodus.

A note on that: Humanity cannot have originated on Earth if Earth is just where the 13th tribe colonized. Where did they originally exodus from? If they go anywhere, I'd guess thats where they will go and settle, that will be the Promised Land. Earth will be left for the future 13th to resettle and eventually re-nuke.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 21, 2008, 09:47:41 PM
Quote from: Calantyr;103704
Yeah, that's all they have left to do...

Except learning the truth of humanities/cylons roots...
Except discovering the final Fith...
Except finding out how various characters have been manipulated throughout the course of the series (visions, etc)...
Except discovering how Starbuck came back from the dead...
Except learning the truth of the Opera house...
Except finding out the significance of the human/Cylon children...
Except finding out what destroyed Earth...
Except trying to survive on their new homeworld...
Except breaking the cycle of destruction that causes humanity to endlessly migrate across the galaxy...
Except defeating the final Cylons if they don't agree to peace...


I'm worried that they won't have ENOUGH time left in the series. Each of these points (and there are more besides) could take up an episode by themselves, and that's not including possible plot twists that throw up new issues.

And then people say they're going to go on a NEW exodus and find another homeworld? In only ten episodes? Even with all the rest of the content they need to fit in?

who says they need to do all this?

It's like Adama says before going to the planet, they've got nowhere else to go and they went as a group, the cylons are just as screwed in their search for earth/a new life/ running from the remaining cylons... they may just say frak it and stop caring about what happened with kara or visions or all that stuff. RDM said he chose an end to the series to have a nice, wrapped up package where he could say how it ends. that doesnt mean they will live happily ever after or answer every one of our questions. As far as we know this has all been a dream and baltar wakes up in the last episode and says wow what a trip.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: David cgc on June 21, 2008, 11:39:12 PM
No one says they need to do all of it. It was just raised as a counter to the idea that the only thing the last ten episodes can do plot-wise is stop the Ones, Fours, and Fives from trying to kill Our Heros. There are plenty of things that can be explored in the back ten.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 22, 2008, 05:39:09 AM
Quote from: Rauko;103710
Not picking on Calantyr in specific, just saying this to start so theres no confusion.



I keep hearing this same sentiment, that somehow they are breaking out of the cycle...


If the ending is a literal interpretation of that phrase (that I'm not even going to repeat because it's so cliche by now), I will be enormously disappointed. To me, that's not an ending. It's essentially saying that the characters' actions were predestined so, essentially, the entire series was meaningless.

I would much rather see an ending where the cost of solving the conflict is so high, and so great, that we as an audience question whether the sacrifice was worth it or not. Or a tragic ending where all of the humans and rebel Cylons die, but somehow the Centurions retain some memory of what happened and there are overtures to an overthrow.

Something that wraps the series up, not something that coyly evades a definite ending. There've been way too many episodes in the series that've been like that for them to end it like that.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Calantyr on June 22, 2008, 09:44:41 AM
I never meant to imply that those points would have a happy ending, or that they are actually possible. They are simply plot points that are still left to address in one way or another.

By the end of the series the human race may become extinct, but to say that there's no content left to even *try* and show is quite inaccurate.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: DangerousDan on June 22, 2008, 10:08:47 PM
Have we not coined onto the possibility that the Colonies may just be the descendants of Earth? Do the maths, folks! The Ruins on Kobol (if I am not mistaken) are 2,000 years old. The sites Galactica encounters on the road to earth are progressively older and older. I believe the Temple of Five was 4,000 or 5,000 years old. Think about it! The Twelve Tribes allegedly left Kobol amidst a 'Great Burning' upon an 'Ark'. However, the ground of Kobold whilst ruined was unmarred by any nuclear fallout. My own personal theory is that humanity fled Earth after this nuclear war upon a big ship, eventually happening upon Kobol. I think old texts being what they are, the accounts got misunderstood somehow and the legend of the 13th Tribe arose.

As for what they do next, without Cavil's Cylons to hunt them down, settling upon Kobol would perhaps be a prudent solution. Or maybe a return to the Cylon Homeworld? These factors have sort of beeing forgotten, and I'm uncertain how many Cylons remain in the Colonies and on the Homeworld itself.

Thoughts?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 23, 2008, 12:33:49 AM
Quote from: Wolfy;103644
yes, they have these 'magic med kits', however, do you think they have enough for the entire fleet to survive on earth, and remake the human race there. thats over 30,000 med kits per day maybe?


And where is that half forgotten sense to determine what's irony and normal talk out here? :)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 23, 2008, 02:41:52 AM
I love it whenever somebody new comes along, makes a point they think no one else has discussed and then we have another 10 pages of bullshit erupt in a crappy thread. Go team!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 23, 2008, 02:57:56 AM
What you don't watch re-runs? :P
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: DangerousDan on June 23, 2008, 11:08:13 AM
Quote from: Cl1nt;103786
I love it whenever somebody new comes along, makes a point they think no one else has discussed and then we have another 10 pages of bullshit erupt in a crappy thread. Go team!


;D

Glad to be of help.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: James on June 23, 2008, 11:22:06 AM
maybe the Eastern alliance annihalated the planet?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 23, 2008, 02:23:32 PM
Quote from: Cl1nt;103786
I love it whenever somebody new comes along, makes a point they think no one else has discussed and then we have another 10 pages of bullshit erupt in a crappy thread. Go team!


Billy/Zak is the fifth!1!11oen1neo1!1

discuss.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Mauler85 on June 23, 2008, 07:14:35 PM
at least they won't go BS 1980

But here's my idea. They are the Founders of the Greek Society. I think it will all end in a major stand off ending with all of the ships being destroyed either with a few thousand left on the surface or all hands.

1st scenario ends with the eventual De-evolution of the survivors much like we see with people who get stranded on secluded islands. Evenually over the millenia?? cultural De-Evolution follows.

2nd scenario all that is left is a books, scrolls, and texts that survived in the bigger chunks of the ships and what crawls out of the ashes of whatever happened to Earth. Thus creating the Greek Gods and Constilations
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: harmy_tr on June 24, 2008, 11:17:11 PM
I hate to wait , for start 2009. :(
Title: Or maybe
Post by: tol82go on June 25, 2008, 05:05:35 PM
There is something that has been totally over looked. So much of the os is tied in to the re-imagining.

1 - the cylon virus
2 - Baltar negotiating with the fleet and being dumped by the cylons
3 - The malfunctioning raider (on the os it was a malfunctioning cylon)
4 - The development of a prototype recon viper
5 - The negotiation with the colonial convicts to help the fleet
6 - Starbuck helping a resistance on another planet (on the new series it was Caprica)
7 - Cain and the Pegasus with an agenda to destroy the cylons at all cost but being lost in battle
8 - The battle that cripples the Galactica and leaves Tye giving the command to seal off that part of the ship killing almost 100 crew members

So as you can see the story is changed but still based on the original. Which brings me to some missing keys to the story.
In the original starbuck was given the coordinates to Earth by the Beings of light on the ship of lights but they where not really the coordinates to Earth they where instead the coordinates to a planet called Terra. See the Beings of Light wanted Apollos help saving the planet from a war. Which brings me to the new series. I dont think they are on Earth and I think when Starbucks ship blew up she was transfered to the Ship of light that was hiding in the Maelstrom. They reproduced her ship and implanted some memories of Terra (Earth) and sent her back to the fleet. The fleet thinks they are going to earth from the coordinates in the ship and inturn end up on Terra. but I think what we have yet to see is that there is a war still raging on Terra but the war has taken its toll and they are in do position to take on this huge fleet that arrives so they are in hiding.
All speculation but I find it hard for the new series to leave out such a significant part of the original as the Beings of Light.
Also to speculate on the 5th cylon, I think it has to be someone that was on that ship when she said that. I think we can rule out Rosilin cause she has a purpose as the dying leader, and I am pretty sure we can rule out Baltar. (this is out there)But what about Six? Maybe there where 2 models that where similar in looks and that is why Deanna does not want anyone to know. Think about it, the picture on the sci-fi website shows 2......There has to be some signifigance to it.
These are just my crazy thoughts, let me know what everyone else thinks...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Josh_88 on June 25, 2008, 10:58:42 PM
one problem is the constellations match up, so the planet is Earth. And RDM said no aliens, so the beings of light would have to be portrayed in a way as to make them not alien-like.
Title: maybe
Post by: tol82go on June 26, 2008, 12:37:06 AM
I still have to bevieve the Beings of Light work into the equation some how. Maybe they are the 13th colony evolved some how. In the original they where way more advanced than the rest where and if I remember correctly whenever someone encountered them everything was like new and like a dream (Starbucks ship) which makes me wonder where some of the visions come from. The os ended before the Beings of Light could ever be explored deeper. There has to be an explanation for Starbucks ship blowing up and her being back now. Starbuck being a cylon does not work. Plus she had that whole ordeal with her mom that would make that pointless if she was a cylon. Maybe she is a half cylon? That might work....
The waiting is going to be tough.lol
Oh one other thing...There has been a lot of emphasis on Boomers baby what what about Tyrols baby. How much more special is his since he is one of the 5. Or maybe we will find out that Cassi was one of the 5 and now there is serious trouble cause it was Torre that killed her.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 26, 2008, 06:03:08 AM
I don't think it's a false earth, either.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 26, 2008, 06:29:01 PM
False Earth would really sort of be a lame boring plot twist.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Tikey on June 26, 2008, 09:40:48 PM
They are in a second matrix!

Or wait, that's from somewhere else.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 26, 2008, 09:56:09 PM
*romo lampkin walks on screen*
"This is my world Mr. Adama, my world! and here, I am god!"

ummm, oops...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 27, 2008, 01:23:07 AM
"Do think that is really the air you are breathing?"
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: WMCoolmon on June 27, 2008, 05:53:05 AM
So...Neo is the last Cylon, and Battlestar Galactica actually found earth after the war with the Machines.

That would make a strange amount of sense.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Wolfy on June 27, 2008, 11:16:39 AM
Why do i see Vipers and Raptors flying in the underground tunnel system?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 27, 2008, 11:31:39 AM
Quote from: Wolfy;104039
Why do i see Vipers and Raptors flying in the underground tunnel system?


They are trying to blow the Tyllium refinery, that's why they flying through the conveyer tunnels. :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 27, 2008, 11:57:25 AM
Quote from: Wolfy;104039
Why do i see Vipers and Raptors flying in the underground tunnel system?


Those Sentinels would be sooo frakked.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Dragonfly on June 27, 2008, 06:38:51 PM
So I dont know if anyone else has put fourth this theory yet but I guess I will one of my friends came up with it based on some suggestions I made...

[spoiler] Supposedly in the next episode they will find starbucks original viper with starbuck dead inside and that that is where the colonial signal that led them to earth is coming from so... My friend's thought ( as well as mine) is that Kara ended up going through a wormhole or something reached earth and was flying in atmosphere, some nation picked her up on radar as an unknown contact freaked out thought they were being attacked and that led to WWIII. That's the short version of it anyway. She isn't the harbinger of doom for humanity in the fleet but for all humanity on earth.[/spoiler]
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: TESLA on June 27, 2008, 08:04:14 PM
interesting theory.......

might actually be onto something there.....


who knows ;)


Im just pissed ive to wait until 2009 to find out what the frak has happened to our lovely blue planet :mad:

I blame Cl1nt.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Angelus on June 27, 2008, 08:24:01 PM
Quote from: TESLA;104057

I blame Cl1nt.

Yeah, he gave way to many internets away, and we know what a internet can do in the wrong hands...;)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on June 27, 2008, 08:38:09 PM
damn.. 2009.. that sounds fat and distant...
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Crixx on June 27, 2008, 09:15:34 PM
Just like you.

OOOOH!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Cl1nt on June 28, 2008, 01:32:21 AM
I regret nothing!
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: KewlToyZ on June 28, 2008, 02:35:27 AM
"I don't do regret" :p
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Werthead on July 03, 2008, 01:24:14 AM
Mojo blogs here  (http://darthmojo.wordpress.com/2008/07/02/bsg-vfx-revelations/)about how they created the CGI for the episode. Pity the guy who had to hand-match the tracking shot from the camera and the CGI of the island city, all three thousand frames of it :eek2: Not to mention the guy who created the whole five-million-polygon model.

His take on the city? It's Vancouver. Which we knew :rolleyes: He wouldn't say what the city is supposed to be in the context of the show though. Damn him.
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Deckard on July 03, 2008, 01:01:49 PM
Quote from: Crixx;104063
Just like you.

OOOOH!


you calling me fat and distant?
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: aFrI on July 03, 2008, 03:54:28 PM
hopefully they will find out that they are all cylons... :>
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: SFM Hobbes on July 03, 2008, 08:10:15 PM
Methinks what they landed on is just another lesson being taught to them by those that came before.  It seems obvious that whoever is leading them to Earth is likely:

a.  more sociologically advanced (seems they can afford to use their old self-nuked civilization as a learning tool for others now)

b. more technologically advanced (helloooo, Starbuck's shiny new viper with some kind of secret tech installed)

c.  Still alive (dead people don't give random starbuck's passing through their system new vipers)
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: guitarfan01 on July 05, 2008, 04:00:54 PM
love your "c" point, hobbes. :D
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Jangiri on July 13, 2008, 06:17:22 PM
3 letters for revalations
wtf
Title: Episode 4x10: Revelations speculation/discussion MAJOR SPOILERS
Post by: Arch_Angel on July 14, 2008, 02:07:11 AM
one letter/symbol for revalations......


!


says it all